What sticks to walls, and what throws it?

Posted Aug 13, 2009 21:38 UTC (Thu) by sbergman27 (guest, #10767)
In reply to: What sticks to walls, and what throws it? by ncm
Parent article: Dell: Linux netbook returns a "non-issue" (ZDNet)

On the contrary. One thing I have noticed about the comments on sites on which the story has been reported, there have been a remarkable number of commenters being over backward, and performing logical contortions of alarming complexity, in order to claim that Mr. Finch was not saying what any any sane and unbiased person would conclude that he was saying. There seem to be a lot of people out to spin this in a very negative way for Linux. Normally, when people speak of astroturfing, I can't help but wonder about their grips upon reality. But this time, *I* find myself wondering just who may really be on who's marketing department's payroll. Or, at least, what unhealthily strong biases they may have for whatever reasons.

What sticks to walls, and what throws it?

Posted Aug 13, 2009 21:59 UTC (Thu) by drag (guest, #31333) [Link] (4 responses)

There are actually a lot of Windows fanboys out there. They just refuse to admit it to themselves. (How can they be fanboys when everybody agrees with themn since Windows has 95% market penetration?!)

What sticks to walls, and what throws it?

Posted Aug 13, 2009 22:12 UTC (Thu) by sbergman27 (guest, #10767) [Link] (3 responses)

Honestly, drag, I think that Windows fanboys are largely created by... Mac and Linux fanboys. I think that our well-meaning fanboys, who think they are doing so much good, annoy *some* Windows users enough to turn them from neutral observers into active enemies. (Granted, the latent tendency probably already has to exist within the Windows user.)

It is far easier to create enemies than friends. And it is easier to destroy than to create. A single enemy can do more harm than 10 friends can offset. Which is why discouraging fanboys of all types is an integral and important part of my strategy to help Linux, and OSS in general, to succeed.

And yes, before you say it, I do sometimes violate that policy.

What sticks to walls, and what throws it?

Posted Aug 14, 2009 0:28 UTC (Fri) by drag (guest, #31333) [Link] (2 responses)

> Honestly, drag, I think that Windows fanboys are largely created by... Mac and Linux fanboys. I think that our well-meaning fanboys, who think they are doing so much good, annoy *some* Windows users enough to turn them from neutral observers into active enemies. (Granted, the latent tendency probably already has to exist within the Windows user.)

Sometimes that is absolutely true.

But I've met people that seriously seriously do actually like Microsoft. They like them a _lot_. Microsoft and Microsoft products make them a lots and lots of money and they look up to them. They like Office, they like Windows. They think that the PC revolution and the rise of the internet is due in no small part to the direct action of Microsoft on the market.

Don't fool yourself. They are shocked react badly when people tell them that Microsoft software is shit, just like a lot of Linux folks are shocked that people think that Linux is just a passing faze perpetuated by a bunch of aging neckbeards in their mom's basement.

What sticks to walls, and what throws it?

Posted Aug 16, 2009 13:44 UTC (Sun) by efexis (guest, #26355) [Link] (1 responses)

There is a big different between saying "Windows is great" and "Windows is the best" ... only one of them implies knowledge/comparison of the alternatives. Anyone who falls into to second category (substituting any OS) will move others they interact with in the first category into the second, because it's the comparison that adds the element of negativity, at which point negative things about the alternatives become as much a part of the argument for why yours is the best as the positive things about your own.

"They are shocked react badly when people tell them that Microsoft software is shit"

And are you surprised? Tell someone something that's not true in an insulting mannor, especially if it's regarding a tool they use for their work/life, they're not going to find it flattering. There is a lot that Microsoft do well, if not the best, the fact that they also have a hell of a lot to answer for doesn't change that. OSS has its weak spots, and all MS have to do is be better at one of those, and somebody need that thing, and your argument "their software is shit" completely falls on its knees.

Narrow views on either side help no one, nor do spouting subjective statements in the guise of objective statements. Try "Microsoft software's shit for my needs" and you might get better response. And for the record, I'm neither Linux or Windows fanboi; most of systems are Linux, but I've found I always need one Windows, because some things on it are plain better. Networking is not one of them. I am however a big fan of truth and accuracy, and will gladly point out the flaws in alternatives where that's concerned :-)

What sticks to walls, and what throws it?

Posted Aug 16, 2009 22:24 UTC (Sun) by drag (guest, #31333) [Link]

> And are you surprised?

No I am not surprised at all. I would actually expect them to react in a negative manner.

What sticks to walls, and what throws it?

Posted Aug 13, 2009 22:02 UTC (Thu) by ncm (guest, #165) [Link] (2 responses)

s: I can't tell what you're disagreeing with. Are you saying that it has, in fact, stuck? Or that it's not only Microsoft flinging it? I must agree with the latter.

What sticks to walls, and what throws it?

Posted Aug 13, 2009 22:05 UTC (Thu) by sbergman27 (guest, #10767) [Link] (1 responses)

I'm not sure. There seem to be people who, for whatever reason, want to spin this in a negative way for Linux.

What sticks to walls, and what throws it?

Posted Aug 16, 2009 13:47 UTC (Sun) by efexis (guest, #26355) [Link]

There are always people who will spin anything in a negative way. Looks at what's going on in America, where universal healthcare initiatives are being spun as "death squads"... people just love to hate, nothing you can do except not be one of them.