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Very cool

Very cool

Posted Aug 1, 2024 19:26 UTC (Thu) by Phantom_Hoover (guest, #167627)
In reply to: Very cool by paulj
Parent article: Pulling Linux up by its bootstraps

What would make Thompson’s point is a working demonstration of a backdoor that’s durable to even basic countermeasures, or one found in the wild. Yet more science fictions about what an impossibly perfect program could allegedly do aren’t going to cut it.


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Very cool

Posted Aug 2, 2024 8:43 UTC (Fri) by chris_se (subscriber, #99706) [Link]

> What would make Thompson’s point is a working demonstration of a backdoor that’s durable to even basic countermeasures, or one found in the wild. Yet more science fictions about what an impossibly perfect program could allegedly do aren’t going to cut it.

I think Thompson's argument is correct in a philosophical sense, but not in a practical sense. I agree with you in that I don't believe that such a super-backdoor doesn't exist.

But other supply chain attacks are real (as we've seen with e.g. the XZ backdoor). And I applaud any work that tries to make it harder and harder for such an attack to occur undetected. Methods that can detect vastly more sophisticated (and possibly unrealistic) attacks will also help detect the more realistic ones.

I also think that most developers aren't thinking enough about supply chain attacks in the modern world. So I'm very excited about projects that push these types of ideas more into the current zeitgeist.

Very cool

Posted Aug 6, 2024 3:02 UTC (Tue) by NYKevin (subscriber, #129325) [Link] (1 responses)

As I explained upthread,[1] the original attack is, was, and has always been a fantasy, and so it is logical to conclude that Thompson was not speaking literally. I think it is plausible to read Thompson as anticipating the general(!) category of attack which includes the xz backdoor. I would summarize this interpretation of Thompson as "supply chain attacks don't have to be visible in source code to be effective."

[1]: https://lwn.net/Articles/984430/

Very cool

Posted Aug 6, 2024 8:54 UTC (Tue) by chris_se (subscriber, #99706) [Link]

> I would summarize this interpretation of Thompson as "supply chain attacks don't have to be visible in source code to be effective."

Regardless of whether Thompson himself meant it like that or not, I really like your summary. It's catchy enough that one could make a t-shirt out of it. :-)


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