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Empowering users of GPL software

Empowering users of GPL software

Posted Oct 23, 2021 19:26 UTC (Sat) by Wol (subscriber, #4433)
In reply to: Empowering users of GPL software by kpfleming
Parent article: Empowering users of GPL software

> Indeed, since Vizio is only obligated to provide the CCS to SFC (as the purchaser of the devices),

WHOOPS!!! That is ONLY true if Vizio supplied the software AT THE TIME OF PURCHASE!

Now that Vizio has failed to supply the software WITH the TV, the only way they can come back into compliance is to make it available to EVERYONE.

Cheers,
Wol


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Empowering users of GPL software

Posted Oct 24, 2021 7:04 UTC (Sun) by NYKevin (subscriber, #129325) [Link] (4 responses)

Could you please explain, with a specific numbered section reference, what part of the GPL(v2) you are citing? I cannot find that provision anywhere in the document.

It seems fairly obvious to me that:

* Vizio is not in compliance with any of the three options under section 3 (at least, based on the publicly-available information that I have seen about this case thusfar).
* Section 4 says that their copying is unauthorized and their license rights are terminated, because they failed to comply with section 3. But SFC does not have standing to sue over that, and isn't claiming it as a cause of action. So we can (probably?) ignore that.
* Section 5 states that Vizio has "accepted" the GPL by "modifying or distributing the program (or any work based on the Program)."
* SFC is trying to argue that this "acceptance" is a binding contract, and that Vizio must therefore comply with at least one of the three options under section 3.

I don't understand what part of this argument implies that Vizio must supply the software to everyone. Of course, it's a moot point, since anything given to the SFC will almost certainly be made public as soon as the litigation concludes. But if (for example) big tech companies start suing each other under this theory, they might behave differently, so this question really does matter and is not entirely academic.

I suppose you are arguing that they cannot "accompany" the binaries with the source, because the binaries were already distributed to the SFC? Contrary to popular belief, judges hate this kind of "well, actually" semantics hair-splitting argument. It is no longer possible to *literally* accompany the binaries with the source, but providing source after the fact is obviously the next-best thing. A judge would likely either order money damages to make up the difference (i.e. "Here's how much money the SFC lost by not having access to the source code for X months/years, and that monetary loss was caused by Vizio failing to provide source, so now Vizio has to pay the SFC that much in damages"), or just call it "de minimis" and rule that supplying the source after the fact is close enough (i.e. "The SFC didn't lose any money by not having access to the source code for X months/years, so Vizio doesn't have to pay them anything at all").

This may sound unfair, and perhaps it is, but a more interesting question, to my mind, is whether the SFC will even get as far as arguing this point in the first place. Before they can begin to argue over "accompanying" vs. "providing after the fact," the SFC first has to establish that *just* paying money damages would be inadequate to cure the violation all by itself. Money damages are usually favored as the clean and simple way to fix a contractual violation, and courts don't like ordering specific performance unless there's no reasonable alternative. So it's entirely possible that the court will rule as follows:

1. Vizio violated the contract.
2. SFC had rights under the contract, which were harmed by Vizio's breach.
3. But SFC is not in the commercial software business. They don't make software, they don't sell software, and they don't employ software developers. So they suffered no actual commercial damages as a result of the breach.
4. SFC "wins" and gets nominal damages of $1. Vizio is ordered to comply with the contract in the future, and they do so by pulling the specific product(s) that SFC purchased.
5. The end (at least until a company that *does* make software buys a Vizio product and sues over it, anyway).

Empowering users of GPL software

Posted Oct 25, 2021 19:30 UTC (Mon) by Wol (subscriber, #4433) [Link] (3 responses)

Read GPL v2 s3.

It is YOUR choice whether you comply with 3a or 3b (Vizio does not have the option of 3c).

They did not comply with 3a (supplying the code with the TV), therefore they have to comply with 3b (supplying the code to ANYONE who asks).

Read 3b carefully - it says "ANYONE who ASKS ...", not anyone who bought a TV ...

Cheers,
Wol

Empowering users of GPL software

Posted Oct 25, 2021 19:33 UTC (Mon) by Wol (subscriber, #4433) [Link]

Note that SFC is claiming "specific performance", namely saying that "Vizio say they have a licence under the GPL. Please, Mr Judge, will you tell them that if they have a licence under the GPL, they have to do what it says, namely comply with Section 3b and give us (AND anybody else who asks) a WORKING and CORRECT copy of the code ..."

Cheers,
Wol

Empowering users of GPL software

Posted Oct 25, 2021 23:28 UTC (Mon) by NYKevin (subscriber, #129325) [Link] (1 responses)

> They did not comply with 3a (supplying the code with the TV), therefore they have to comply with 3b (supplying the code to ANYONE who asks).

I already addressed this in my comment.

Empowering users of GPL software

Posted Oct 25, 2021 23:38 UTC (Mon) by NYKevin (subscriber, #129325) [Link]

But to further elaborate: They did not comply with either 3a ("Accompany it with the complete corresponding machine-readable source code...") or 3b ("Accompany it with a written offer, valid for at least three years,...") because they did not accompany the TV with anything at all. So now they have to retrospectively comply with one of 3a or 3b in order to cure their violation (and they might also have to pay damages, but no judge is going to order them to invent a time machine). There is no term in the GPL which says it has to be 3b.


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