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A fork for the time-zone database?

A fork for the time-zone database?

Posted Oct 10, 2021 19:36 UTC (Sun) by divanise (subscriber, #71550)
In reply to: A fork for the time-zone database? by mbunkus
Parent article: A fork for the time-zone database?

> The most universal way is to store just a single name field.

Mostly agree, but storing two fields ("full name", eg "Johnathon Hancock", and "goes by", eg "Johnny") is a significant improvement for roughly equivalent effort over the naive "first name/last name" approach. I've advocated for "full/goes by" ever since I first came across it, but often fail due to either legal obligations or API restrictions that require collecting "first name/middle initial/last name".


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A fork for the time-zone database?

Posted Oct 10, 2021 19:52 UTC (Sun) by mbunkus (subscriber, #87248) [Link] (1 responses)

But "goes by" is again incredibly dependent on both context and culture. When do you go by that name? Is it what friends call you? Co-workers? Remote acquaintances? Are you OK with emails sent to you using that "goes by" name, or would that be way too informal (and how would the sender of the email know)? Are you supposed to write your legal name in the "full name" field exactly as written on your official documents (passport etc.), or would it suffice to use whatever you usually use (e.g. Beth Smith instead of Elizabeth Smith)? Should the "goes by" field include your family name if you have one? Do you need to give both if both are usually the same?

I fear such two fields would be even more confusing to users than the typical but widely used "given & family name" or similar, meaning the entity storing the data couldn't realistically make good use of it.

Of course there are instances where you need specific pieces of information, e.g. if you need a person's name as given on their passport (for official things such as crossing borders). And maybe it's useful to have an additional fields for more informal communication between that entity and you. But if that's the case (and I'd guess that such cases are really rare), be explicit in what you name those fields, really explicit, so that there's no doubt what they'll be used for. For example: "Name as written on your passport" and "Preferred name for us to use when communicating with you".

A fork for the time-zone database?

Posted Oct 11, 2021 15:04 UTC (Mon) by smurf (subscriber, #17840) [Link]

Easy. You don't ask "goes by", but "how would you like to be addressed when we send emails or letters to you".

As one datapoint, nowadays I need to provide all three of my "first" names on banking-related douments because of the current crop of gobsmackingly dumb regulations. But nobody should ever use anything but the second of those names to address me. No, not the first, and certainly not all three, I'm not the male equivalent of Pippi Longstockings dammit.

Now this is certainly a First World Problem compared to people who are named O'Hare and cannot even enter that due to broken Bobby Tables Prevention filters, much less my acquaintance Aahz (yes that's his single real-life name), or … the list goes on.

A fork for the time-zone database?

Posted Oct 10, 2021 20:07 UTC (Sun) by mpr22 (subscriber, #60784) [Link] (1 responses)

I go by (Forename) and am happy for corporate and governmental correspondence to open with "Dear (Forename)" (but also perfectly content for it to open with "Dear Mr (Forename)".

If I were more conservative about correspondence etiquette, I would expect it to open with "Dear Mr (Surname)"... but if I were that conservative about correspondence etiqutte and had a knighthood that they knew about, I would expect them to address me as "Sir (Forename)". And I would expect all of that without having to "jump through hoops" on their website, expecting simply putting my title, forename, and surname to be sufficient.

And as I am, I get mildly grumpy about letters opening "Dear (Forename) (Surname)" because they fall between two stools, satisfying neither my own casualism nor the standards expected by the formalist in my head.

A fork for the time-zone database?

Posted Oct 23, 2021 15:23 UTC (Sat) by nix (subscriber, #2304) [Link]

Every time this comes up I am obliged to post this, from years ago: http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/00138...

Given the perennial state of UK government software I'm sure this is all a thousand times better by now! (Oh wait, that was a typo. I meant "worse".)

A fork for the time-zone database?

Posted Oct 11, 2021 9:25 UTC (Mon) by farnz (subscriber, #17727) [Link]

Ultimately, the "right" thing to do is to have a "name for this purpose" field, provide some pre-fill features that helps someone with an expected naming convention fill in what you expect. Bear in mind that "full name" is itself ambiguous - is the full name "Paul Daniels" (which was the only name on much of his ID), or "Newton Edward Daniels" (as per his birth certificate, and marked as an additional full name on his passport)? You may even need multiple full names for one person…


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