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EPEL 8.0 released

EPEL 8.0 is out. "EPEL stands for Extra Packages for Enterprise Linux and is a subcommunity of the Fedora and CentOS projects aimed at bringing a subset of packages out of Fedora releases ready to be used and installed on various Red Hat Enterprise Linux (RHEL)." Beyond the update to RHEL (and CentOS) 8, this release features a new faster-moving "playground" package stream and support for the s390 architecture.


From:  Stephen John Smoogen <smooge-AT-gmail.com>
To:  devel-announce-AT-lists.fedoraproject.org, EPEL Development List <epel-devel-AT-lists.fedoraproject.org>, epel-announce-AT-lists.fedoraproject.org
Subject:  Announcing EPEL-8.0 Release
Date:  Wed, 14 Aug 2019 10:50:24 -0400
Message-ID:  <CANnLRdjgSUe9iqmr8SWGmHM984yXpEH8P4-dL_prdw8MxokLvA@mail.gmail.com>
Archive-link:  Article

The EPEL Steering Committee is pleased to announce that the initial
EPEL-8 is ready for release. We would like to thank everyone in the
community for helping us get the initial set of builds out to mirrors
and to consumers worldwide. Special thanks go to Patrick Uiterwijk,
Jeroen van Meeuwen, Robert Scheck, and many others in the community
who helped in the last 6 months to get this release done.

EPEL-8.0 has packages for the x86_64, ppc64le, aarch64, and now the
s390x platforms.

## What is EPEL?

EPEL stands for Extra Packages for Enterprise Linux and is a
subcommunity of the Fedora and CentOS projects aimed at bringing a
subset of packages out of Fedora releases ready to be used and
installed on various Red Hat Enterprise Linux (RHEL). It is not a
complete rebuild of Fedora or even of previous EPEL releases. EPEL is
also a community and not a product. As such we need community members
to help get packages into the repository more than done in Fedora.

If you are interested in getting a package into EPEL, contact the
package maintainer through bugzilla. This way the request can be
tracked, and if the primary maintainer is not interested in branching
to EPEL, others can step in and do so. Optionally you can send a
request to the epel-devel@lists.fedoraproject.org mailing list. If you
do so, please include why the package is needed, to help other
volunteers decide whether they can support it.

## What is new?

### Playground for Rawhide like things
We have added an additional set of channels for EPEL-8 called
playground. It is similar to Fedora Rawhide so packagers can work on
versions of software that are too fast moving or will have large API
changes compared to versions in the regular channel.

To make this purpose transparent, when a package is built in epel8, it
will normally also be built in epel8-playground. This is done via a
packages.cfg file which lists the targets for fedpkg to build against.
A successful package build will then go through two different paths:
* epel8 package will go into bodhi to be put into epel8-testing
* epel8-playground will bypass bodhi and go directly into
epel8-playground the next compose.

If a packager needs to focus only on epel8 or epel8-playground they
can edit packages.cfg to change the target=epel8 epel8-playground to
target=epel8.

Packages in epel8-playground are intended to be used in the following manner:
* To test out a new version of the package that might not be stable yet.
* To test out new packaging of the package
* To test a major version change of the package intended for the next
EPEL-8 minor release.
* To build a package that will never be stable enough for EPEL-8, but
still could be useful to some.

At minor RHEL releases (ie, 8.1, 8.2) people can pull in big changes
from playground to the main EPEL-8 packages. Since people will be
upgrading and paying more attention than usual anyhow at those points,
it’s a great chance to do that change, but you can test beforehand in
the playground to make sure these changes work.
Consumers should be aware that packages in EPEL8-playground are
without any Service Level Expectations. You may want to only cherry
pick packages from the playground as needed.

### New Architecture: s390x

We have added the s390x platform to builds. Some consumers have wanted
this platform for many years but we did not have the time to integrate
necessary changes. We have done this with EPEL-8, and hope to be able
to do so for EPEL-7 if there are continued requests for it.

## What is next? (Why is it called EPEL-8.0?)
The goal for EPEL-8.1 will be implementing modules into the
repository, which allows builds for packages that depend on
non-shipped devel packages. It also allows maintainers to supplement
and replace other packages they could not under standard EPEL rules.

## Known Issues:
1. EPEL-8.0 does not come with modules. Packages built for perl,
python and other modules are only built against “default” modules. For
example installing a perl library from EPEL will work with the
perl-5.26 but not with the perl-5.24 module.
2. RHEL-8.0 and RHEL-8.1 beta do not come with the same packages in
all architectures. There are 720 ‘desktop’ packages which were only
shipped for x86_64 and ppc64le. Packagers looking to deliver GNOME,
KDE, or other platforms will need to exclude s390x and aarch64 at this
time.
3. The dnf in RHEL-8.1 beta does not work with the EPEL repository due
to zchunk code. This has been opened as an upstream bug as
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1719830
4. Until modularity and module builds are implemented in EPEL, there
will be many packages which can not be built for EPEL. This is mainly
due to RHEL-8 not shipping many -devel packages and the need for us to
rebuild those packages in a module to make those -devel available to
build against. When running into this please open a ticket with
https://pagure.io/epel/new_issue for us to put in a request for it to
be added to Red Hat’s Code Ready Builder. Please list the package(s)
which is blocked from being built because of its absence. We will
collate these items into bugzilla tickets which will be reviewed by
the Red Hat product groups to see if they will be added in future Code
Ready Builder releases. Doing this will ensure that we do not have 70
requests for foo-devel but can have one with all the packages needing
it.
5. /usr/bin/python does not exist in RHEL8. Developers should aim
towards /usr/bin/python3 or /usr/bin/python2 and patch appropriately.
Python2 packages are discouraged. RHEL-8 will contain python2.7 until
probably the end of life of RHEL-7. However support upstream will only
be minimal. When modularity occurs, we suggest that you make whatever
python2 packages modules which can be pulled out when RHEL-8.N no
longer has python2.
6. python2-sphinx is not shipped. Most packages should work with
python3-sphinx, and if it doesn’t please open a bug. The python team
has been good about making fixes for this.
7. When branching python packages, be aware that python in EL-8 is
python36 and not the version currently in rawhide. This has come up
with a couple of test packages where they assumed python37 or later.
8. While EL-8 comes with platform-python, it should NOT be used in
Requires: unless absolutely necessary. python3 should be used instead.
(Exceptions can be made but will be rare and need justification.)
  * Accepted exception: Use python3.6dist(coverage) instead of
python3-coverage. This package is not shipped but is needed in %check
code.
10. Sometimes RHEL8 only has a python3 package for a dependency you
need for your build. (Example: python-bleach requires
python2-html5lib, but RHEL8 provides only python3-html5lib). For
EPEL-8.0 we recommend strongly to only focus on python3 subpackages..
11. RHEL-8 was built with packages which were not shipped. In general
it is OK to branch these packages and build them in EPEL.
12. systemd-rpm-macros is not a separate packages. If needed, used
BuildRequires: systemd
13. You will need to make sure you have a version of fedpkg greater
than fedpkg-1.37-4 to work with both `epel8` and `epel8-playground`.
Versions before that should work with just `epel8`.

## Developer requests for multiple branches
Branching is handled the same way as requesting a branch using fedpkg
request-branch. A maintainer can request an epel8 branch using fedpkg
request-branch epel8 which will create a ticket in
https://pagure.io/releng/fedora-scm-requests/issues and Release
Engineering will process these requests.
To branch multiple packages please use this or a variant of this script:

```
#!/usr/bin/sh
# Reminder to get an updated pagure token for releng tickets
# Usage: epel-8.sh package1 package2 package3 package4
if [ $# -lt 1 ]
then
    echo "At least one package name should be provided"
else
    TMPDIR=`mktemp -d /tmp/epel8.XXXXXX`
    pushd "$TMPDIR"
    for pkg in "$@"
    do
        fedpkg clone "$pkg"
        pushd "$pkg"
        fedpkg request-branch epel8
        fedpkg request-branch epel8-playground
        popd
    done
    rm -rfv "$TMPDIR"
fi
```

Releng will then work through the tickets in the system which is
adding branches to the PDC and src.fedoraproject.org.

## Known RHEL-8 packages missing -devel
* libblueray-devel
* liba52-devel
* libXvMC-devel
* libdvdnav-devel
* gfbgraph-devel
* libuv-devel
* rest-devel
* qgpgme-devel

## Definitions
* Package maintainer. Person who has accepted responsibility to
package and maintain software in the Fedora Project ecosystem. The
main packager is usually someone focused on Fedora Linux, and
secondary packagers may be focused on particular use cases like EPEL.
* Consumer. A person who has subscribed to EPEL for packages but is
not a maintainer.
* PDC. Product Definition Center. A tool to help list the lifetime and
permissions that a product has so that branching and updates can be
better managed.




-- 
Stephen J Smoogen.
_______________________________________________


to post comments

EPEL 8.0 released

Posted Aug 14, 2019 17:40 UTC (Wed) by cyperpunks (subscriber, #39406) [Link]

Great news, thanks!

Python 3.7

Posted Aug 14, 2019 22:54 UTC (Wed) by yodermk (subscriber, #3803) [Link] (5 responses)

I do hope they get Python 3.7 packaged in the near future.

Bit of a rant: It's been out for over a year, and RPM packages don't even exist for EL7, much less EL8. No doubt there's huge demand for it.

It's not even in Red Hat Streams yet, and I thought the whole point of Streams was to get developers the latest languages and such in a timely manner. https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-us/red_hat_ent...

So far the best Python 3.6 packages for *EL have been in the IUS repository, and its maintainer is shifting them to EPEL, and rightly so. I'm not sure how many other people are intending to work on that. I get that it's one of the more complex packages. I'd be willing to try to help but given its complexity am not confident in my packaging ability at that level. At minimum I can test and try to offer packaging tweaks, so guess I'll join the EPEL Python SIG.

Not blaming anyone, because it's no one's job in particular to provide this, just wondering how there could be such a huge gap in the *EL/Python ecosystem.

Googling for installing 3.7 on CentOS 7 invariably leads to articles telling you how to compile from source, which from a systems engineering perspective is an absolute non-starter. I guess Docker would be an option, and might be the best way to go, unless packages show up soon.

Python 3.7

Posted Aug 14, 2019 23:48 UTC (Wed) by dowdle (subscriber, #659) [Link]

podman, not docker, eh.

Python 3.7

Posted Aug 15, 2019 8:40 UTC (Thu) by amacater (subscriber, #790) [Link] (2 responses)

Python 3 is in RHEL 7.7, as just released. When CentOS get to package that once 8.0 is finished, Python 3 will be available just as it is upstream.

This _finally_ because 2.* dies next year and this is the last feature release for RHEL 7.* as it enters maintenance phase. [Maintenance phase 1 until 2020, 2 until 2024]
This point release was slightly earlier than expected

Just as EPEL 8 is significantly different from that for 7, so the release of SCL 8 for RHEL / EPEL 7 is the last in that form, I think.

Python 3.7

Posted Aug 15, 2019 9:25 UTC (Thu) by yodermk (subscriber, #3803) [Link] (1 responses)

RHEL 7.7 has Python 3.6, not 3.7. 3.6 has been available via IUS and maybe other repos for a long time. I'm specifically wondering how it can be that no reputable repo has pushed 3.7 RPMs. Is it that much harder to package than 3.6?

Python 3.7

Posted Aug 15, 2019 10:53 UTC (Thu) by dsommers (subscriber, #55274) [Link]

It's not that 3.7 necessarily is hard to package. But the whole "instrumentation" around it when Red Hat provides packages needs to be considered.

When Red Hat decides to package something and distribute it, they put a lot of resources into it. They will have allocated dedicated package maintainers for it, security teams are tasked to keep an eye on what happens with these packages, QA teams needs to allocate resources for testing and ensure regression tests are present and running. Then the release teams which needs to ensure packaging is done accordingly to the RHEL standards, that packages are installable, can be upgraded, downgraded and uninstalled without issues, etc. And on top of that, the support teams needs to get knowledge about this package. And all this is an effort which they dedicate for multiple years.

So with all this, it is a noticable cost for Red Hat to commit themselves to ship yet another Python release. I'm not saying it won't happen, but I would more expect it to happen at a later point where Python 2.x truly is dead and there are even more interesting Python releases which has stabilized.

Of course you can argue that the gap between 3.6 and 3.7 is so small lots of the current 3.6 efforts can be reused on 3.7. But then it comes into a prioritization challenge. If there are urgent issues needed to be solved in both 3.6 and 3.7, which should be resolved first? And will Red hat customers be happy if 3.7 gets priority when their own software stack depends on 3.6?

We can't solve all this in a discussion, and at least not here in the LWN comment section. But it is important to understand that when Red Hat ships a package, they're really highly committed to ensure it is maintainable over a longer time and strive to ensure it doesn't explode in the face of their users.

Python 3.7

Posted Aug 15, 2019 18:04 UTC (Thu) by yodermk (subscriber, #3803) [Link]

Another thought, I get that there are reasons Red Hat is hesitant (even though with Streams it's kind of the whole point of that). But it still leave a huge hole in the Python/*EL ecosystem.

Maybe the PSF should sponsor a project that maintains a quality YUM repo that always builds the latest Python for supported *EL/Fedora distros. For example, the PostgreSQL Global Development Group sponsors the excellent https://yum.postgresql.org/ to do just that for PostgreSQL. As such, I'm confident that as soon as PG 12 is released, I'll be able to easily leverage it. Yeah, I get the PSF is stretched too, but surely it is in their interest to have the latest Python readily available on *EL. I wonder if they could get sponsorship for it.

EPEL 8.0 released

Posted Nov 8, 2019 19:14 UTC (Fri) by msteele (guest, #135405) [Link] (1 responses)

Is there a plan to include rsnapshot in EPEL 8.0?

EPEL 8.0 released

Posted Nov 12, 2019 8:29 UTC (Tue) by seyman (subscriber, #1172) [Link]

There's a request pending.


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