The Internet of bricks

Posted Apr 7, 2016 16:51 UTC (Thu) by karkhaz (subscriber, #99844)
In reply to: The Internet of bricks by NAR
Parent article: The Internet of bricks

> But would anybody want a light bulb, heating or air conditioning that does not work without network connection?

Agreed, but

> The phone is not useful without the network. The router or the IP TV set-top box is not (that) useful without the network.

s/the network/a network/g

If your implication is that it is fair for some devices (but not others) to be tied to a service---I disagree with both of your examples.

You should be able to switch your phone/router/Nest to use a different carrier/ISP/home automation service. For example, in many countries, one can easily use a different cellular carrier by changing the SIM card in one's mobile phone. But in the USA, you cannot do this, because phones use CDMA, which (as I understand) ties the phone to one particular carrier.

It would be wonderful if somebody could create the OpenNest service that owners of Nest devices could switch to, either if their devices are bricked, or even if OpenNest is better than the built-in offering. This would foster competition, and reduce obsolescence: this is a very important point that Dianne made above. Of course, this won't/can't happen.

The Internet of bricks

Posted Apr 8, 2016 3:46 UTC (Fri) by dlang (guest, #313) [Link] (7 responses)

> But in the USA, you cannot do this, because phones use CDMA, which (as I understand) ties the phone to one particular carrier.

Actually, AT&T and T-mobile are GSM and the phones are able to move between them. Verison and Sprint use CDMA, at least mostly. I've heard that at least one of them is now offering GSM/SIM based service.

The biggest issue has historically been the phone service contract that included and hid the cost of the phone. Thanks to T-Mobile, that has changed over the last 5 years or so and now phones are a separate purchase (with financing available) from every carrier.

The Internet of bricks

Posted Apr 8, 2016 18:39 UTC (Fri) by mathstuf (subscriber, #69389) [Link] (6 responses)

CDMA doesn't require a SIM card and those without one are locked to a network. If you do have one, the SIM is locked to the phone (probably the IMEI or something) and cannot be transferred to another phone (apparently; I've never even tried).

The Internet of bricks

Posted Apr 9, 2016 1:19 UTC (Sat) by neilbrown (subscriber, #359) [Link] (4 responses)

> If you do have one, the SIM is locked to the phone

It is the other way around, almost. The phone is locked to the carrier. The phone will reject any SIM that doesn't have the correct country/carrier prefix.
At least, that is my experience. Here in .au you can purchase an unlock code from the carrier to unlock you phone - it gets cheaper as time goes by and I think has to be free after 5 years or something. I've done that a couple of times.

The Internet of bricks

Posted Apr 9, 2016 2:59 UTC (Sat) by mathstuf (subscriber, #69389) [Link] (3 responses)

How's that work when you bring your own phone to a CDMA carrier?

The Internet of bricks

Posted Apr 9, 2016 10:06 UTC (Sat) by anselm (subscriber, #2796) [Link] (1 responses)

The point of the exercise is to prevent people from getting a cheap subsidised phone from carrier A and then (more or less immediately) moving to carrier B. Since carrier A uses your monthly fees to recoup the cost of the phone (think of it as an installment plan) it is in their interest to keep you on the books at least until you have paid off the subsidy. If you do want to move to carrier B before the minimum duration of your contract is up and want to keep the phone, carrier A graciously lets you buy out your contract with them in a single payment in order to remove the “net lock” on your phone.

If you provide your own phone when you become a customer of carrier A to begin with, then that phone will naturally not be net-locked to carrier A because carrier A has no subsidy to recoup, so the issue doesn't arise.

The Internet of bricks

Posted Apr 14, 2016 10:33 UTC (Thu) by Wol (subscriber, #4433) [Link]

> The point of the exercise is to prevent people from getting a cheap subsidised phone from carrier A and then (more or less immediately) moving to carrier B. Since carrier A uses your monthly fees to recoup the cost of the phone (think of it as an installment plan) it is in their interest to keep you on the books at least until you have paid off the subsidy. If you do want to move to carrier B before the minimum duration of your contract is up and want to keep the phone, carrier A graciously lets you buy out your contract with them in a single payment in order to remove the “net lock” on your phone.

Which is why, in the UK at least, it's presented to the customer as "a single monthly payment", but internally they account for it as two separate parts, the network service contract and the Hire Purchase contract. You can't cancel the former without paying off the latter.

And it was normal practice - I don't know if that's changed - to continue collecting the "single monthly payment" at the original rate even after the HP part had expired ... :-( Actually, I think they now usually pro-actively offer you a new phone a few months before the old HP expires, and roll the lot over into a new one ...

Cheers,
Wol

The Internet of bricks

Posted Apr 10, 2016 5:13 UTC (Sun) by dlang (guest, #313) [Link]

In general, they give you credit for turning in your old phone and give you a new one that's setup for that carrier.

The Internet of bricks

Posted Apr 10, 2016 5:12 UTC (Sun) by dlang (guest, #313) [Link]

I've moved SIM cards from phone to phone on AT&T and T-mobile (and their derivative networks like metro-PCS). The phone must be unlocked, which you can do if the phone is paid for. If it's not yet paid for, you can pay off the rest of the phone and then they will unlock it. This used to be so tightly confused with the contract that it was really messy. But in the last year or so, the purchase of the phone has become a very separate thing from the rest of the contract. With you buying the phone over time, and deciding how quickly you want to pay it off (sometimes presented to the user as "do you want a free phone every year, every 2 years, etc but if you look at the math, it's a simple purchase with interest)

Verison and Sprint are the last bastions of the old way of doing business, but even they have changed recently. I don't use either of them, but I know that my friends who do are now getting phones with SIM cards in them, so I think they are slowly migrating their networks over.