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The "Devuan" Debian fork and the fuss about systemd

The "Devuan" Debian fork and the fuss about systemd

Posted Nov 29, 2014 11:43 UTC (Sat) by dlang (guest, #313)
In reply to: The "Devuan" Debian fork and the fuss about systemd by Seegras
Parent article: The "Devuan" Debian fork

there's also the issue that what the systemd people consider a horribly obsolete kernel is one a couple of releases back, which is new enough that it may not have made it out to any distros as their stock kernel yet.

We aren't talking about 2.6 kernels, but even 3.14 is old enough to be missing 'critical features'


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The "Devuan" Debian fork and the fuss about systemd

Posted Nov 29, 2014 13:42 UTC (Sat) by misc (subscriber, #73730) [Link] (2 responses)

The doc say 3.7 is required. What is the critical feature requiring 3.14 you are speaking about ?

And if 3.14 is needed for that feature, there is maybe a reason.
( and in practice, requiring new kernel is not really a new debate, since it already erupted in 2006, with the same people like Al Viro and GKH ( http://lwn.net/Articles/193603/ ).

The discussion on the boundaries of kernel space and user space is still not resolved, and that's just yet another issue of it. There is different things that push to that result, from "we should be free to break internal API" to "let's use sysfs to expose internal API to userspace, so we can push more stuff outside of the kernel".

And that's not like we as a community get API right on the first time, kernel, libraries, etc do change the API and ABI, so breakages are expected, and they are expected because there is no coordination nor central deadline, no committee to decide on ABI and not the kind of stuff you would fine in a closed source UNIX. You also happen to see the sausage factory from the inside, so yeah, you see all breakages that are isolated and hidden by a vendor.

The "Devuan" Debian fork and the fuss about systemd

Posted Nov 29, 2014 14:44 UTC (Sat) by cesarb (subscriber, #6266) [Link] (1 responses)

I got curious, searched the systemd git, and found http://cgit.freedesktop.org/systemd/systemd/commit/?id=db....

Basically, kernels older than 3.14 have a bug which causes problems with containers if audit is enabled.

If you don't use containers or don't have audit enabled, that's not a problem.

The "Devuan" Debian fork and the fuss about systemd

Posted Nov 29, 2014 23:20 UTC (Sat) by misc (subscriber, #73730) [Link]

systemd based containers are nice, but they are not really a critical feature, especially since the trend is docker everywhere, or openvz/lxc.

And I didn't even knew that audit and containers on systemd was finally fixed. Maybe not is fixed however.


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