The CHERI capability model: Revisiting RISC in an age of risk (Light Blue Touchpaper)
The CHERI capability model: Revisiting RISC in an age of risk (Light Blue Touchpaper)
Posted Jul 6, 2014 9:50 UTC (Sun) by khim (subscriber, #9252)In reply to: The CHERI capability model: Revisiting RISC in an age of risk (Light Blue Touchpaper) by roblucid
Parent article: The CHERI capability model: Revisiting RISC in an age of risk (Light Blue Touchpaper)
The modern x86-64 is a minor tweak on top of the existing Intel-produced architecture. No amount of handwaving will change that fact.
The claim that AMD “invented” “new” x86-64 architecture is as ridiculous as claim that Benigno Castiglione built Duomo di Milano at the end of last century. Sure, he did some work on it, but his additions were relatively minor and not really all that significant. All the important decisions were made centuries before. Even more ridiculous look the claim that x86-64 superceded an x86: it's continuation of the very same thing! How could one supercede itself? The fact that for once AMD invented something which Intel also adopted (it tried many times: 3DNow!, XOP and so on, but was ignored both by Intel and programmers for the most part) is commendable, but it does not suddenly make an x86-64 a new architecture which could superceded x86. It's still the same old Duomo di Milano x86, just with some modern tweaks.
Posted Jul 6, 2014 10:26 UTC (Sun)
by PaXTeam (guest, #24616)
[Link] (2 responses)
heh, 'minot tweak' (do you have any clue about amd64?) and handwaving. amd64 is a new arch, no question about it, even according to intel, just read the titles of their own manuals: http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/archite....
Posted Jul 6, 2014 12:35 UTC (Sun)
by khim (subscriber, #9252)
[Link] (1 responses)
So now we treat marketing BS as a gospel of truth? Come on. That's just stupid. Do you? I know that people who actually work with said architecture treat it as a single one (with significant tweaks here and there, sure). Both GCC and Linux kernel developers put files for x86 and x86-64 into a single subdirectory of their
Posted Jul 6, 2014 15:20 UTC (Sun)
by PaXTeam (guest, #24616)
[Link]
the directory structure of a source code tree has no bearing on what is a separate architecture (e.g., the BSDs have kept i386/amd64 separate). if anything, it reflects on some wise engineerig design decisions of AMD that kept the two archs close enough that some linux devs managed to drive through the x86 'unification'. as for how successful the x86 merge is:
$ find linux-3.15.3/arch/x86/ | wc -l
so after several years(!) of effort there're almost as many exceptions as 'unified' files, or in other words, it wasn't done because i386/amd64 are the same arch (which is, ironically, something you'd know yourself if you *actually* worked with these archs). so you tell me who's treating marketing BS as a gospel of truth.
Posted Jul 6, 2014 12:46 UTC (Sun)
by roblucid (guest, #48964)
[Link]
Everyone else will use a -march value that is x86-64
Posted Jul 7, 2014 14:20 UTC (Mon)
by rriggs (guest, #11598)
[Link]
The CHERI capability model: Revisiting RISC in an age of risk (Light Blue Touchpaper)
The CHERI capability model: Revisiting RISC in an age of risk (Light Blue Touchpaper)
Even according to intel, just read the titles of their own manuals: http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/archite....
Do you have any clue about amd64?
arch directory for a reason. Note that Linux developers initially treated it as two different architectures, but it made no sense and they were eventually merged. Yes, it's quite significant extension, but so is Sparc64 or 32bit and 64bit versions of POWER architecture.The CHERI capability model: Revisiting RISC in an age of risk (Light Blue Touchpaper)
1255
$ grep -rwn CONFIG_X86_32 linux-3.15.3/arch/x86/ | wc -l
414
$ grep -rwn CONFIG_X86_64 linux-3.15.3/arch/x86/ | wc -l
472
$ grep -rn 'def.*CONFIG_X86_32' linux-3.15.3/arch/x86/ | wc -l
341
$ grep -rn 'def.*CONFIG_X86_64' linux-3.15.3/arch/x86/ | wc -l
403
$ find linux-3.15.3/arch/x86/ -name '*_32.[ch]' | wc -l
59
$ find linux-3.15.3/arch/x86/ -name '*_64.[ch]' | wc -l
61
$ find linux-3.15.3/arch/x86/ -name '*_32.[chS]' | wc -l
81
$ find linux-3.15.3/arch/x86/ -name '*_64.[chS]' | wc -l
101
The CHERI capability model: Revisiting RISC in an age of risk (Light Blue Touchpaper)
The CHERI capability model: Revisiting RISC in an age of risk (Light Blue Touchpaper)
