MythTV 0.24 released [LWN.net]

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 1:06 UTC (Thu) by daglwn (guest, #65432) [Link] (23 responses)

Does anyone use MythTV anymore? I'm sure some people do, but a large number?

I gave up on MythTV for a variety of reasons:

1. Little to no satellite (DirecTV) support (understanding that the satellite people have a lot to do with this issue)

2. Continuous pain on upgrade; sound stops working, MythGame not working for years, etc.

3. A "roll-your-own" DVD player which performs far worse than VLC and friends

4. Releases once a year, at best

5. Releases touting big new features that end up being little more than code refactoring (what revision of MythUI are we on?) or features for the roll-your-own player that already exist elsewhere (check the release notes)

I really wanted MythTV to work. In the end, I got more done using DirecTV's proprietary solution even though feature-wise, it offers far less.

If someone can convince me to try MythTV again, I'm all ears. But it has to work seamlessly with satellite.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 2:15 UTC (Thu) by leoc (guest, #39773) [Link] (2 responses)

I still use it with my satellite. I bought a Hauppage HDPVR and capture with the component outs and the IR transmitter to change channels. I use only a couple of basic plugins, and my backend runs on debian stable. I compile the code from svn and update it fairly regularly. My biggest gripe with it is that it crashes when my wireless network goes down occasionally.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 16:52 UTC (Thu) by daglwn (guest, #65432) [Link] (1 responses)

So part of the problem with satellite is that it's impossible to watch one channel and record another at the same time with MythTV. As far as I know, DirecTV does not provide outputs from both of its tuners. Again, it's the satellite provider's fault.

If that's no longer the case, I would be thrilled.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 17:30 UTC (Thu) by leoc (guest, #39773) [Link]

Not impossible at all. My Canadian satellite provider (Shaw) only provides a single tuner per box but there is nothing stopping me from getting a second tuner and HDPVR (aside from cost). Personally I have rarely found a need for it thanks to having multiple region feeds so shows come on at different times on the one tuner.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 2:54 UTC (Thu) by PhracturedBlue (subscriber, #4193) [Link]

I still use it for exactly one reason: It has the best available commercial detection I've found. I'm now using xbmc for my frontend though, so myth is only in charge of recording and comm-flag.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 5:13 UTC (Thu) by BaldHeadedGeek (guest, #1078) [Link] (12 responses)

I guess it takes writing your own home media system to appreciate the amount of work it takes to come up with something like mythtv. I don't run it anymore but I did use it with DirecTV for many years. In my own project I can use my DirecTV boxes - it's not hard to do.

It's easy to criticize and I am tiring of the fact that in this open source world very few people actually do the work - most sit back and want stuff for free.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 6:28 UTC (Thu) by daglwn (guest, #65432) [Link]

I have no doubt it's a big job. But from my perspective, a lot of time and energy has been burned on rewrites and NIH-driven code. That's simply frustrating for users when there are real bugs to fix. Ignoring that reality is the cause of many a death of a Free Software project.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 6:34 UTC (Thu) by daglwn (guest, #65432) [Link] (10 responses)

I wouldn't exactly call this "easy:"

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Controlling_DirecTV_Set_Top_Bo...

Could I do it? Sure, I've built cables and such many times. Would I rather use my time for something else? You betcha.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 14:47 UTC (Thu) by JEDIDIAH (guest, #14504) [Link] (4 responses)

You are employing a common Windows-user debating tactic: Conflate the most detailed expert level documentation with the typical use case.

Controlling an external cable tuner with MythTV is pretty much like the same on a Tivo. The main exception is that you are building your own Tivo box. You don't have to take the most difficult path possible. You can just BUY an IR blaster or a couple of USB->Serial cables.

Like old school Linux was, it's a matter of needing to put more effort into initial setup for something that is ultimately much more useful.

The situation is certainly not nearly as grim as you want to make it out to be.

There is no comparable appliance for a DirecTV subscriber.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 16:49 UTC (Thu) by daglwn (guest, #65432) [Link] (3 responses)

You are employing a common Windows-user debating tactic: Conflate the most detailed expert level documentation with the typical use case.

I am simply pointing to the available documentation. If there is an easier way, it should be documented in a clear, straightforward manner. This isn't rocket science. Documentation matters.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 17:24 UTC (Thu) by JEDIDIAH (guest, #14504) [Link] (1 responses)

It is. You are just plucking things out of context in order to create a false impression.

You don't have to choose the most esoteric option available.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 23:00 UTC (Thu) by daglwn (guest, #65432) [Link]

It may be the most esoteric, but it's the one that pops up when I search for DirecTV on the MythTV Wiki.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 24, 2010 1:45 UTC (Wed) by BaldHeadedGeek (guest, #1078) [Link]

Someone noticed that the newer DirecTV HD boxes have a web service running that can be used to change the channel. It's an undocumented "feature" of the box but it looks like it would eliminate the need for the USB cable.

Here is a link:

http://mythtv.org/wiki/Controlling_DirecTV_Set_Top_Box_(STB)_via_Network

I haven't tried this yet and I don't think my older H20 box has ethernet port, which of course is required.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 15:02 UTC (Thu) by BaldHeadedGeek (guest, #1078) [Link] (4 responses)

I guess I bought cables that just worked for my two boxes. Just plugging them in is not hard. :) I agree making cables is not easy - but blaming mythtv for unavailable hardware is not right.

If I was going to get something going today, I would look into an ir tranceiver like the one from IguanaWorks:

http://iguanaworks.net/product1.psp

Then I think the channel changing script is a series of irexec commands.

Sure it takes effort to run your own HTPC setup than a solution from DirecTV. Do what makes you happy. It's important for others to know that they have a choice. I'd rather be in control than DirecTV.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 16:56 UTC (Thu) by daglwn (guest, #65432) [Link] (3 responses)

If I was going to get something going today, I would look into an ir tranceiver

Why? It seems like a step backward from a direct serial/usb cable. I'm genuinely curious because LIRC has been very unreliable for me.

Then I think the channel changing script is a series of irexec commands.

This is a real problem. There's no way an ordinary user could set this up, and frankly, spending a few hours fiddling with channel changing scripts is not my idea of fun.

I guess my point is that the MythTV people seem to be focusing on the wrong stuff. Instead of making new plugins and DVD players, they really ought to get the basic setup working in a convenient, DVR-for-dummies kind of way.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 18:03 UTC (Thu) by JEDIDIAH (guest, #14504) [Link]

No. MythTV is not a ready appliance. Of course it isn't. It's PC software. It isn't intended to be free of any sort of cost or effort. It's intended to be powerful and better than everything else.

It's certainly better than any of the appliances, including Tivo.

It is well worth the effort if you care much about your PVR experience.

Otherwise, stick to the shovelware appliance.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 18:21 UTC (Thu) by leoc (guest, #39773) [Link]

LIRC is definitely the weakest link IMHO. I noticed that with kernel 2.6.36 the LIRC drivers have been merged into staging. Hopefully this will help to get them more stable and perhaps easier to use, particularly for the serial IR transmitter.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 21:14 UTC (Thu) by BaldHeadedGeek (guest, #1078) [Link]

I guess the people who are doing the work get to decide what work to do. I don't disagree with you that a "DVR-for-dummies" would be a great goal. You make it sound like no one is trying to do this though - mythbuntu, LinHES, mythdora are certainly trying. I've been in the software biz a long time - making software easy to use is hard to do - but it should always be the goal.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 7:38 UTC (Thu) by BackSeat (guest, #1886) [Link]

Does anyone use MythTV anymore?

Yes.

Releases once a year, at best

Why is that a reason to stop using it?

You make some valid points, but MythTV remains very popular if the mailing list activity is anything to go by, and I don't think what they are trying to achieve is trivial.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 8:20 UTC (Thu) by NAR (subscriber, #1313) [Link] (2 responses)

I've tried it a couple of years ago (never understood why does a TV watching application need mysql server), but didn't work at all, so I wasn't able to use it.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 16:52 UTC (Thu) by dmcguicken (guest, #57851) [Link] (1 responses)

Out of interest, in what way did it not work at all? There was a time in the dim and distant past when Myth setup was a real manual effort and distro packaging was non-existent but it's been fairly mature now for a long while.

I've been using it hassle-free on a little VIA pico-ITX server as the equivalent of an opensource Freeview DVB recorder here in the UK since the Ubuntu 8.04 LTS release.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 17:13 UTC (Thu) by NAR (subscriber, #1313) [Link]

As far as I remember (which is not much), it started, but then I couldn't really click on anything.

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 19:51 UTC (Thu) by ccchips (subscriber, #3222) [Link]

Yes. I record over-the-air TV with it on my Linux Mint Zotac Mag. Any objections?

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 12, 2010 14:15 UTC (Fri) by tim_small (guest, #35401) [Link]

I use MythTV with one DVB-S PCI card, and one DVB-T PCI card.

I only view free-to-air stuff (including the BBC's 1080 HD channels), but I believe that at least in Europe it's possible to use third-party CAM modules to receive encrypted Murdoch-controlled streams using MythTV directly (you need a legit viewing card) - no farting about with trying to control external analogue sources necessary - you just get the raw mpeg streams, as well as associated program guide info via the broadcast EIT data.

I believe directv uses a similar encryption scheme as BSkyB, developed by the same company, so maybe it's possible with that too.

Oh, and it can record multiple channels on the same multiplex at the same time using just a single DVB tuner.

It it opensource after-all, so if it does something you dislike you are free to fix it yourself...

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 7:08 UTC (Thu) by sgros (guest, #36440) [Link] (1 responses)

What is this text in the news announcement:

Show: - All items Show: - Tonoharu Part Two: Excellent graphic novel about an English teacher in Japan from Boing Boing by Mark Frauenfelder Tono2 Tabletopdisplay See my review of Tonoharu Part One Tonoharu is Lars Martinson's

Strange text

Posted Nov 11, 2010 14:04 UTC (Thu) by corbet (editor, #1) [Link]

It's totally weird is what it is. It's also gone now...

MythTV 0.24 released

Posted Nov 11, 2010 19:47 UTC (Thu) by bronson (subscriber, #4806) [Link]

I got MythTV working a few years ago with dual ATSC USB tuners but I found I didn't use it much because it required so much day-to-day maintenance (everything from mysql maintenance to tweaking transcoding and IR remotes to fixing the record list when broadcasters change program names). Far too many hours to spend on mere TV.

The hardware's currently unused sitting unused in my garage: a Pinnacle USB adapter that works great, a Hauppauge HVR 950 that works OK, an ATI radio remote, and some antennas. If anyone is around San Mateo, CA and wants an ATSC MythTV setup (just add a computer), hit me up: bronson on github.