Changing GNOME technical governance?
The GNOME project, which recently celebrated its 28th birthday, has never had a formal technical governance; progress has been driven by individuals and groups that advocated for—and worked toward—a particular goal in an ad hoc fashion. Longtime GNOME contributor Emmanuele Bassi would like to see that change by adding cross-project teams and a steering committee for the project; to that end, he gave a talk (YouTube video) at GUADEC 2025 in late July on his idea to establish some technical governance for the project. He also put together a blog post with his notes from the talk. The audience reaction was favorable, so he has followed up on the GNOME discussion forum with an RFC on governance to try to move the effort along.
In the RFC, Bassi described the motivation for the change. He laid out the
current situation, which has changed little "from the 'rag tag band of
misfits' of the halcyon days of the project's youth
". Governance is
highly informal, which leads to difficulties with the project's overall
direction. "Decision-making is an exercise of sisyphean patience, where
people must push the boulder of the community uphill only to watch it roll
back down with every cycle.
"
He quoted from the GNOME Project Handbook; the governance section describes how decisions are made:
Most decisions in GNOME are made informally, by individuals working in collaboration with one another. This informal way of making decisions applies to who works on what, which features are supported, and which technical and user experience designs are implemented.
His goal is to switch away from the "informal" and "individual" parts of
that and instead to "create formal, shared structures to increase
accountability while diffusing personal responsibility
". GNOME has
a set of existing
teams, but they are not aligned to the components and applications that
make up the project. GNOME is, effectively, a collective of individual
projects, each of which is maintained by a single person or, more rarely, a
small group, with no mechanism for those projects to collaborate:
There is no formal venue for discussing changes across multiple projects. There is no formal process to propose changes across multiple projects. Each project is its own special, unique snowflake when it comes to interaction with other projects, both as dependencies and reverse dependency.
One potentially troubling problem is that there is no documented way to
change the technical-governance situation. The GNOME Foundation board is not
part of the technical governance of the project; it is focused on the
foundation itself, overall strategic goals, financial oversight, and the
like.
Bassi is proposing to form four
new teams (platform, OS, core apps, and tooling) that would join with
four existing teams (design, release, translation, and infrastructure) to
form a steering
committee with a single representative from each team. The committee
would be responsible for setting the "overall direction and vision
"
of the project, its priorities, and generally being the ultimate
decision-making authority for GNOME, as well as for the teams and sub-projects.
Though it is not specified, some kind of project-wide referendum would
presumably be needed to enact this, or some other, governance structure.
The teams would be responsible for deciding on whether to accept features and other changes within the projects in their domain. They would communicate in public forums, so that others in the project can have a view into their plans. The teams would form the basis for more collaborative, cross-project planning and development, while the steering committee would oversee all of the teams and the GNOME project as a whole.
The RFC has more detail about the makeup and responsibilities of each team, the structure and duties of the steering committee, term limits, and more. But, at the core of his vision, and, seemingly, his unhappiness with the way that GNOME works currently, is the maintainer model for GNOME projects. The RFC does not go into as much detail, though it clearly looks toward replacing project maintainers with cross-project teams, but the blog post says more:
Individual maintainers should not exist in a complex project—for both the project's and the contributors' sake. They are inefficiency made manifest, a bottleneck, a point of contention in a distributed environment like GNOME. Luckily for us, we almost made them entirely redundant already! Thanks to the release service and CI pipelines, we don't need a person spinning up a release archive and uploading it into a file server. We just need somebody to tag the source code repository, and anybody with the right permissions could do that.We need people to review contributions; we need people to write release notes; we need people to triage the issue tracker; we need people to contribute features and bug fixes. None of those tasks require the "maintainer" role.
There have only been a few replies to the RFC post, all generally favorable, but there are questions about getting rid of the maintainer role. Adrian Vovk thought that there may not really be enough people in GNOME to fill the roles that are being described. He wondered if the end result would be to continue the maintainer role, though perhaps without the name:
Overall, my concern is that we don't have enough people for this bureaucratic process to shift us away from the status quo. It seems to me like we'll still have de-facto "maintainers" who have the institutional knowledge over their corner of the stack. Not even necessarily because folks want to hoard institutional knowledge, but simply because we don't have enough people interested in involving themselves. Someone needs to keep triaging issues/reviewing MRs/fixing bugs/etc, and it's going to be the people who know most about a specific codebase. I fear the end result will be teams that have members working on unrelated projects, or grouped into subteams that consist essentially of individuals.[...] I suppose a valid course of action is just to accept that this is what it is, and that the people with de-facto power today (by being a maintainer of a project) will have formal power when we put these structures into place (by being the sole interested party for a project on the relevant team). But I'm not certain that this is all you intend to achieve.
Bassi pointed out
that the "Drawbacks"
section of the RFC mentioned the lack-of-people problem, but that the aim
is to "bring in new contributors that have so far resisted the role of
'maintainer'
". But Michael Catanzaro suggested
that removing maintainers was "unrealistic
":
GNOME is a big collection of small projects, and teams with a large scope and perspective are just not a better way of working on small projects. I see only two possible ways that ends: (a) we'll continue to have de facto maintainers and everything operates same as before, except without any way to formally indicate who the maintainer is, which is not an improvement; or (b) we take "no maintainers" seriously until chaos ensues and eventually we change our minds and bring back maintainers.
He noted that the RFC did not directly call for removing maintainers and he
saw no problem with forming teams as an experiment. Creating a steering
committee to relieve the current release and design teams from serving in
that role is "a clear improvement
", he said. Bassi seemed to
bristle a bit about the concerns expressed by Vovk and Catanzaro with
regard to the need for maintainers. Bassi wondered if it was because they
were too strongly focused on the recognition aspects of being the
maintainer of a project. The attention on the maintainers question seemed to
irritate him some, as seen in his reply to
another generally
favorable response from Allan Day:
Ideally, instead of people hyperfocusing on whether or not I'm trying to remove the role of maintainers like I'm proposing the installation of guillotines in the middle of Place de la Revolution, we'd see people proposing additional teams and sub-teams.
Bassi, Catanzaro, and Vovk appeared to be talking past each other to a
certain extent.
Both Catanzaro and Vovk were largely in favor of the ideas, but expressed concern that there
were simply not enough people to fill the teams,
which would inevitably mean that some interested developers would be acting
as maintainers anyway. Catanzaro explicitly
rejected the notion that he was focused on recognition and agreed with
Bassi that the maintainer model is flawed: "The fact that maintainers
have final say on everything is a defect in our current development model,
and I appreciate that you're trying to fix that.
" But there is a need
for some person or entity to have responsibility for ensuring that the
critical work of maintaining a project is actually done:
So my question is: how will high level teams decide who will read the issue tracker, respond to merge requests, flag security issues for GNOME Security, etc? Components cannot be overlooked. If you join the Platform team, then will you dutifully help with triaging libxslt issue reports? I rather doubt it, but the team will need to ensure that somebody does so. Maintainership seems like the best way to define this responsibility, but as long as each high level team truly has a plan to take responsibility for each of the dozens of components within its extremely broad purview, I suppose that's sufficient.
That is as far as the conversation has gotten at the time of this writing; we will have to wait and see where it goes. The goals of the proposal seem popular, while some of the details will still need to be worked out—all par for the course in a free-software-governance discussion. What is unclear, however, is how to actually enact the change, since there is no steering committee or other overarching technical-governance decision-making body. One suspects that if the proposal (or some, yet-to-be-revealed alternative) gains steam, GNOME will figure that out in due course.
We have seen other projects undertake this kind of change before, notably Python; Bassi has clearly looked into governance, and changes to it, in other free-software communities as part of coming up with his proposal. Someday, other projects may also look to GNOME for guidance, when they reach a point where change is needed. It is yet another benefit of building our communities in the open.
Posted Aug 28, 2025 11:19 UTC (Thu)
by cyperpunks (subscriber, #39406)
[Link] (7 responses)
Posted Aug 28, 2025 12:17 UTC (Thu)
by remmy (subscriber, #4400)
[Link] (6 responses)
Posted Aug 28, 2025 12:33 UTC (Thu)
by rschroev (subscriber, #4164)
[Link] (3 responses)
Posted Aug 28, 2025 14:04 UTC (Thu)
by farnz (subscriber, #17727)
[Link] (2 responses)
KDE has always been Free Software (GPL, LGPL or MIT/BSD licenses), but it depends on Qt; up until Qt 4.0 (used by KDE 4.0), Qt was licensed under various non-free licenses that were probably GPL-incompatible if a distro shipped both KDE and Qt.
GNOME was one direction to addressing this; the KDE folk took a different route, leading first to the KDE Free Qt Foundation, guaranteeing that Qt would become properly Free if the owners of Qt stopped releasing versions for Free software use, and this in turn led to a GPL'd Qt version.
The other thing that was discussed at the time, but never happened, was someone independently reimplementing enough of Qt for KDE, allowing Qt to be swapped for this new implementation.
Posted Sep 8, 2025 15:53 UTC (Mon)
by ndiddy (subscriber, #167868)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Sep 8, 2025 16:04 UTC (Mon)
by farnz (subscriber, #17727)
[Link]
Qt was GPL'd about a year after GNOME's release.
Posted Aug 29, 2025 17:35 UTC (Fri)
by cyperpunks (subscriber, #39406)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Sep 1, 2025 1:26 UTC (Mon)
by da4089 (subscriber, #1195)
[Link]
Posted Aug 28, 2025 12:05 UTC (Thu)
by jhe (subscriber, #164815)
[Link] (18 responses)
When i tried the recent GNOME, i felt lost because little of my acquired knowledge was transferable, and only few possible interactions are indicated by the UI. I compensated that by searching the Web on how, for example, switch between Windows of the same Application.
Is there something to current GNOME that Windows 95 was to GNOME 2? That i need to learn, that makes me grok it intuitively? What is the missing ingredient?
Posted Aug 28, 2025 12:50 UTC (Thu)
by zdzichu (subscriber, #17118)
[Link] (16 responses)
Posted Aug 28, 2025 13:01 UTC (Thu)
by GhePeU (subscriber, #56133)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Sep 1, 2025 19:13 UTC (Mon)
by sramkrishna (subscriber, #72628)
[Link]
Posted Aug 28, 2025 13:06 UTC (Thu)
by daroc (editor, #160859)
[Link]
I'm not sure I believe that. I don't use GNOME, but I don't believe there's any such thing as an "untainted" user. We're all shaped by our experiences. And if you find Super+Tab
(from
GNOME's list of keyboard shortcuts) an intuitive way to switch between windows in an application, that intuition has to have come from somewhere.
Posted Aug 28, 2025 14:18 UTC (Thu)
by Wol (subscriber, #4433)
[Link]
If you come from a clean slate, then NOTHING is intuitive !!!
Youngsters find mobile phones intuitive because they play with them 24/7. Whenever I use a mobile for anything other than phone calls, it's an absolute nightmare of discovery and what the hell does this do and why has that happened, because I just don't use the damn thing from one week (month?) to the next, and the subtle changes that keep happening just get me utterly confused.
Stuff is only intuitive because you play with similar stuff and are used to it. I took to WordPerfect (DOS, WP5.1) because it very consciously mimicked the blank page of a typewriter. I found Word (and Writer) and still do, very UNintuitive, because they're not familiar to anything else in my experience (not least because I'm a words person, not a visual person).
Cheers,
Posted Aug 28, 2025 15:19 UTC (Thu)
by jhe (subscriber, #164815)
[Link]
Posted Aug 29, 2025 8:49 UTC (Fri)
by Karellen (subscriber, #67644)
[Link] (1 responses)
"The only intuitive interface is the nipple" -- Bruce Ediger, 1995 (kinda)
Posted Aug 29, 2025 8:59 UTC (Fri)
by mjg59 (subscriber, #23239)
[Link]
Posted Aug 29, 2025 9:25 UTC (Fri)
by paulj (subscriber, #341)
[Link] (7 responses)
Worst of all, once they figured out how to get to the screen with the endless pages of app icons: "Daddy, how do I organise them into folders?" - "Uh, I don't think you can".
I've been trying to get them to try another DE. Mate or KDE.
Posted Aug 29, 2025 9:32 UTC (Fri)
by gdiscry (subscriber, #91125)
[Link] (6 responses)
Worst of all, once they figured out how to get to the screen with the endless pages of app icons: “Daddy, how do I organise them into folders?” - “Uh, I don’t think you can”. I’ve just tried it, you drag and drop them. If you want to create a folder, you drop one on top of an other (which is a pattern I learned on Android).
Posted Aug 29, 2025 11:30 UTC (Fri)
by Wol (subscriber, #4433)
[Link] (2 responses)
If you do it by accident AND REALISE WHAT YOU'VE DONE, it's "oh that's interesting ..."
If you do it by accident and DON'T realise what you've done, it's "where the hell have my icons vanished!"
If it's done for you by Google with a new phone (as happened to me), it's "why have these apps disappeared from the default screen ???"
Cheers,
Posted Aug 29, 2025 11:47 UTC (Fri)
by knewt (subscriber, #32124)
[Link] (1 responses)
Because with the base knowledge that most people have from their mobiles & tablets nowadays, people without historical computer experience will probably just think it works as they would expect. And those with historical experience (I would certainly put myself in this group) may be puzzled or annoyed at first, but I can certainly see the reasoning behind it, even if change is frustrating (noting I have not used GNOME in an incredibly long time)
Posted Aug 29, 2025 12:24 UTC (Fri)
by Wol (subscriber, #4433)
[Link]
And this is where the whole thing falls flat on its face.
As I expressed above, I'm not in the "most people" category, and actually, neither are any of my close associates! I doubt there are many like me who just have absolutely no interest, but there are an awful lot who, thanks to age or illness, are simply incapable of adjusting to or using tablets and smartphones.
Most of my knowledge comes from being forced to do it for other people - life is getting harder and harder for the - certainly in my circle - ever growing number of people who just can't do it.
Cheers,
Posted Sep 2, 2025 9:23 UTC (Tue)
by paulj (subscriber, #341)
[Link] (2 responses)
Posted Sep 2, 2025 13:23 UTC (Tue)
by gdiscry (subscriber, #91125)
[Link] (1 responses)
As far as I known, GNOME dropped desktop icons and using the desktop as a folder with GNOME 3, even in the GNOME Classic session. I don’t think there is still a “supported” way to enable them back (extension, Tweaks). However, there is an animation (after ~1s) when I drag an icon over another, at least on GNOME 48.
Posted Sep 3, 2025 13:30 UTC (Wed)
by ebassi (subscriber, #54855)
[Link]
The desktop icons extension used by Ubuntu is maintained and typically kept up to date even before the next stable release: https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/2087/desktop-icons...
Posted Sep 11, 2025 9:47 UTC (Thu)
by davidgerard (guest, #100304)
[Link]
Posted Sep 1, 2025 19:11 UTC (Mon)
by sramkrishna (subscriber, #72628)
[Link]
Posted Aug 29, 2025 5:09 UTC (Fri)
by wtarreau (subscriber, #51152)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Sep 1, 2025 19:55 UTC (Mon)
by sramkrishna (subscriber, #72628)
[Link]
Posted Sep 4, 2025 23:18 UTC (Thu)
by himdel (subscriber, #15569)
[Link] (1 responses)
Am I being too cynical here? :)
Posted Sep 5, 2025 9:37 UTC (Fri)
by paulj (subscriber, #341)
[Link]
Value extracted in multi-million salaries to a non-technical. non-contributing 'governance' class?
Cynical, tu? moi?
A memory
A memory
Gnome's origin
Not KDE per-se, but the underlying Qt framework.
Gnome's origin as an alternative to Qt
Gnome's origin as an alternative to Qt
This is all taking place in the 1996 to 1999 timeframe, with the fuss accelerating in 1998 with the release of KDE 1.0.
Gnome's origin as an alternative to Qt
A memory
A memory
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
Wol
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
Wol
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
Wol
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
What am i missing?
Design by committee...
Design by committee...
We know how this ends
We know how this ends