Doesn't the GECOS field already cover some of this use case?
Doesn't the GECOS field already cover some of this use case?
Posted Dec 6, 2024 14:32 UTC (Fri) by khim (subscriber, #9252)In reply to: Doesn't the GECOS field already cover some of this use case? by zeha
Parent article: Debian opens a can of username worms
I would say it's “yes” and “no”, simultaneously.
I have meet a lot of people who simply don't know English well enough to type name in ASCII.
Unfortunately the majority of them I have meet when they cried on various forums about how unfair it is that they “have only just used Cyrillic (Arabic, Farsi, etc) name” – and now have so many broken programs they couldn't even count them all.
Yes, it's deeply anglophonic, yes, it's unfair, true, people genuinely suffer if your force that on them…
But the experience says that it's still better for them to lean 1 (one) English world (their account name) once then suffer through innumerable programs that don't support any other names properly.
Posted Dec 6, 2024 21:46 UTC (Fri)
by epk (guest, #174765)
[Link]
And it's not as though a non-Latin-alphabet username would really help that much, since so much text - especially in path names and URLs - is in English. There is, however, the full name of each user, and I'm guessing that should be much easier to have non-Latin UTF-8 in. And for non-computer-literate users who need a lot of hand-holding, they might actually see mostly/only their full names.
Posted Dec 7, 2024 10:18 UTC (Sat)
by NYKevin (subscriber, #129325)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Dec 7, 2024 10:59 UTC (Sat)
by khim (subscriber, #9252)
[Link]
You wouldn't. Obviously people who couldn't type ASCII wouldn't ever do (and don't plan to do) anything in the command line. That's fine, the majority of computer users don't ever use command line and are not interested in the command line (many don't even know it exists). But even for them using non-ASCII letters in the $HOME is PITA. Simply because programs stop working – and changing $HOME temporarily brings another layer of pain.
Posted Dec 18, 2024 21:34 UTC (Wed)
by ssmith32 (subscriber, #72404)
[Link]
Yes, what a shame they can't just lean one world. Or just learn to live in one English world.
(yeah, cheap shot, but come on, if you're gonna get on a soapbox about folks learning to spell one word, you really should double check that you spelled *word" correctly, and avoid inadvertently proclaiming that there is one English World - it's the kind of thing that could end up really getting under a Scot's skin).
Posted Dec 21, 2024 21:18 UTC (Sat)
by steffen780 (guest, #68142)
[Link] (3 responses)
Similarly, until 2010 or so I would not use äöüß in filenames. Ever. To this day I still only use my native languages properly for low-risk "user-only" files - so I might use it for a LibreOffice file or a video, but I would not use it for a login username, anything in /etc, and so on. I just don't want the extra hassle. But I'm fairly advanced with IT - how is a typical user supposed to know that some software still can't handle such things, many DECADES after the problem was partially solved with Unicode? Do we really expect children today to learn a 1950s (!) encoding just so they know what characters they can use in a username? Surely there's more useful things that can be taught instead. E.g. pretty much anything else ;)
That being said: I wouldn't hold my breath for non-ASCII login usernames to become reliably usable with the infamous "long tail" of software. But huge progress has been made, and I think it's important to keep going.
Posted Dec 22, 2024 12:26 UTC (Sun)
by NAR (subscriber, #1313)
[Link] (1 responses)
we really expect children today to learn a 1950s (!) encoding
What they need to know is the English alphabet. And as English is the international language nowadays, we can expect them to learn this while they learn English. Besides, we're using lot of stuff "hardcoded" in the previous centuries, from the metric system to normal gauge, the Latin alphabet itself, etc. the list of characters in the original ASCII charset is just one of them.
Posted Dec 22, 2024 13:55 UTC (Sun)
by zdzichu (subscriber, #17118)
[Link]
I wouldn't be surprised, given the number of Polish people in the UK.
Posted Dec 23, 2024 9:25 UTC (Mon)
by taladar (subscriber, #68407)
[Link]
I wouldn't call that "solved it many decades ago".
Doesn't the GECOS field already cover some of this use case?
Doesn't the GECOS field already cover some of this use case?
Doesn't the GECOS field already cover some of this use case?
Doesn't the GECOS field already cover some of this use case?
Or just lean on one word to avoid learning English.
Or something.
Doesn't the GECOS field already cover some of this use case?
One of the restrictions I set when we chose our children's name was to avoid accented characters - for the very same reason, to avoid possible problems during travel. For various reasons I lifted this restriction for our third child - of course he was the one born abroad :-) I was very (and pleasantly) surprised when the British clerk managed to produce a proper ó for the birth certificate - I think she saved us quite a headache.
Doesn't the GECOS field already cover some of this use case?
Doesn't the GECOS field already cover some of this use case?
Doesn't the GECOS field already cover some of this use case?