Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
"Ubuntu 8.04 Long Term Support (LTS) Server Edition adds new features to
enhance the performance, stability and security of this fully supported
general platform. The LTS release sees further expansion of the commercial
ecosystem of software, hardware and services vendors supporting Ubuntu
Server.
"
"Ubuntu 8.04 Long Term Support (LTS) provides a stable platform for
software and hardware vendors, developers and users. With three years of
support and maintenance on the desktop, 8.04 LTS is a great choice for
large-scale deployment. A substantial and growing ecosystem of free and
commercial software built for Ubuntu provides a rich set of choices for
desktop users. This is the eighth desktop release of Ubuntu. Ubuntu's
track record in delivering - on a precise schedule every six months - a
commercial operating system that is free, stable, secure and fully
supported, remains unique.
"
Posted Apr 22, 2008 18:15 UTC (Tue)
by ArbitraryConstant (guest, #42725)
[Link] (25 responses)
Posted Apr 22, 2008 19:37 UTC (Tue)
by jwb (guest, #15467)
[Link] (8 responses)
Posted Apr 22, 2008 23:09 UTC (Tue)
by vmole (guest, #111)
[Link] (7 responses)
"Waaah! Debian never keeps its release schedules!"
Okay, lets make a Debian-like distribution that hits its schedules and is close to bleeding edge.
"Waaah! Ubuntu ships buggy stuff!"
Grrrrrr.
(Not aimed at jwb in particular, BTW. Just pointing out that there's always going to be some disappointed people.)
Posted Apr 22, 2008 23:16 UTC (Tue)
by ArbitraryConstant (guest, #42725)
[Link] (4 responses)
Posted Apr 23, 2008 6:29 UTC (Wed)
by joib (subscriber, #8541)
[Link] (2 responses)
Posted Apr 23, 2008 8:47 UTC (Wed)
by alankila (guest, #47141)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Apr 23, 2008 17:31 UTC (Wed)
by felixrabe (guest, #50514)
[Link]
Posted Apr 23, 2008 6:36 UTC (Wed)
by man_ls (guest, #15091)
[Link]
Posted Apr 23, 2008 7:46 UTC (Wed)
by mjthayer (guest, #39183)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Apr 24, 2008 17:54 UTC (Thu)
by vmole (guest, #111)
[Link]
Uh, so that would be Debian, yes?
Debian 3.1 (sarge), released 6/2005, updated 12/2005, 4/2006, 9/2006, 11/2006, 2/2007, 4/2007, 12/2007, 4/2008. Debian 4.0 (etch), released 4/2007, updated 8/2007, 12/2007, 2/2008. Admittedly not a rigid 6 month cycle, but not too bad. Also, you can pull from propesed-updates any time.
The www.backports.org site allows specific selection of individual packages. Using "apt-get -t etch-backports install foo" seems reasonably easy and granular to me. Of course, not every single package is backported, but most of the popular stuff is.
Posted Apr 22, 2008 19:49 UTC (Tue)
by proski (subscriber, #104)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Apr 22, 2008 20:00 UTC (Tue)
by ArbitraryConstant (guest, #42725)
[Link]
Posted Apr 22, 2008 21:16 UTC (Tue)
by alankila (guest, #47141)
[Link] (4 responses)
Posted Apr 22, 2008 21:17 UTC (Tue)
by alankila (guest, #47141)
[Link] (3 responses)
Posted Apr 23, 2008 1:09 UTC (Wed)
by nlucas (guest, #33793)
[Link] (2 responses)
Posted Apr 23, 2008 7:37 UTC (Wed)
by alankila (guest, #47141)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Apr 23, 2008 14:26 UTC (Wed)
by nlucas (guest, #33793)
[Link]
Posted Apr 23, 2008 4:46 UTC (Wed)
by csamuel (✭ supporter ✭, #2624)
[Link]
Posted Apr 23, 2008 6:41 UTC (Wed)
by BackSeat (guest, #1886)
[Link] (2 responses)
YearOfLinuxDesktop += 2;
Posted Apr 23, 2008 12:51 UTC (Wed)
by eru (subscriber, #2753)
[Link] (1 responses)
Ubuntu != Linux. For instance, the past few Mandriva linux versions I have run at home have worked so well as the desktop it is getting boring :-)
A few "brown bag releases" years ago + Ubuntu hype reduced Mandrake/Mandriva mindshare as a desktop Linux (it was once considerable), but I think people should give it a fresh look.
Posted Apr 23, 2008 14:37 UTC (Wed)
by TxtEdMacs (guest, #5983)
[Link]
Posted Apr 23, 2008 7:05 UTC (Wed)
by lacostej (guest, #2760)
[Link]
Posted Apr 23, 2008 11:51 UTC (Wed)
by Felix.Braun (guest, #3032)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Apr 23, 2008 19:23 UTC (Wed)
by Felix.Braun (guest, #3032)
[Link]
Posted Apr 23, 2008 16:56 UTC (Wed)
by docomo (guest, #32926)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Apr 24, 2008 17:29 UTC (Thu)
by docomo (guest, #32926)
[Link]
Posted Apr 22, 2008 21:24 UTC (Tue)
by a_hippie (guest, #34)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Apr 23, 2008 0:52 UTC (Wed)
by nlucas (guest, #33793)
[Link]
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
The server edition seems to be doing fairly well, but on the desktop there's a number of bugs,
some of them significant regressions, that make me nervous about the quality of this release.
Particularly given its status as an LTS.
Examples:
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug...
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager...
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/188226
There isn't time to fix these now, and major changes in behavior post-release are very tricky.
Basically, I don't think the LTS we're going to have for the next 2 years will be a
high-quality one, and this is profoundly disappointing.
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
There's a huge number of regressions from 7.10 to 8.04 on my laptop, including that it now
takes 2-3 *minutes* to wake from sleep. But the Ubuntu project has always had a "ship it!"
mentality. Luckily we'll only wait six months for the next release ...
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
I think a corollary to meeting schedules is dropping features from a given release if they're
too ambitious. Some of these IMO qualify as show-stoppers.
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
What's so irritating is that at least some of these are really simple and obvious fixes. The
kernel could be fixed with a 1-line change in the kernel config. PulseAudio is a good idea
IMHO, but most of the problems with it seems to be due to not shipping an out-of-the-box
config that is optimized for PA, like the "PerfectSetup" page on the PA wiki. What the heck
where they thinking?
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
I have a written a few ALSA applications in my time. Nothing serious, though. While I hold no
love for ALSA, I also do not appreciate the pulseaudio developers' apparent attitude that
everything not using their shit is legacy. (A comment to this effect is written on the
pulseaudio bug page at launchpad.) Maybe if they win out in the game of popularity they are
right, eventually.
I configured pulseaudio for sound playback on my desktop box with SB Live! and digital audio
link. It was a painful experience. After I toggled the option on in the gnome-sound-properties
dialog (which talks about ESound), it started PA. Then I forced the default pcm & ctl to
pulseaudio through .asoundrc, but got no sound. Applications were playing happily, so I
suspected a routing mishap.
The problem here was that the default alsa sink is the analog output sink, and there is no
toggle to switch digital output on instead. Missing an option like this is probably acceptable
for software with 0.x version number, I guess. I'd hazard that pulseaudio guys would see less
migration resistance if they didn't configure "front:0" as the output device (which should be
explicitly the 2 analog sound channels of a N-channel setup) but used "hw:0" instead, because
that would work the same way as ALSA does per default.
Yet another nail in this coffin. *sigh*
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
> Yet another nail in this coffin. *sigh*
No, opportunity for change.
Ubuntu doesn't have a lot of new features that can be dropped. There are a many packages to integrate, and that is a lot of work, but you cannot just drop them. Were you thinking about some features specifically?
Dropping features
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
I suppose what I would personally love to see would major releases "when they are ready" (à la
Debian), but six monthly updates, consisting of the last major release plus all backports
which fulfil the right stability criteria. Plus a nice easy and granular way to enable
backports on just the software that you really need to be more up-to-date and its
dependencies. This last would also improve testing of software in the upcoming release.
Plus perhaps even an additional level of backports so that you can use certain software at
"developer tree" level if you are particularly interested in it, or badly need a certain new
feature.
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
I'm not a Ubuntu user, but why would the LTS status be a problem for fixing the regressions? Would not a longer support time cause more bugs to be fixed? After all, package maintainers would be more motivated to fix something that needs to be maintained for years, rather than something that becomes obsolete within months.
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
The problem is that in an LTS release, you really don't want to be making significant changes
in behavior mid-release. For some of these bugs (eg, the pulseaudio issues and kernel
scheduler issues I linked to above), people are going to have to work around them because
they're pretty much broken by default.
Coming along post-release with a fix has a good chance of breaking the workarounds, which is
bad because entire point of doing snapshotted releases (particularly LTS releases) instead of
continuous upgrades like Gentoo is to keep intra-release updates safe. Fixing these problems
after the official release will be anything but safe.
You are correct that there's a greater incentive to keep the LTS versions maintained over
their (lengthy) term of support, but this is why it's imperative to get things right at the
time of release. Failing to do so results in broken behavior that has to be preserved.
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
Ouch. I've hit all three of those issues myself, even that sudo thing, which was especially
infuriating.
Damn, this would call for a .1 bugfix release or something, or everyone ends up fetching some
backport/whatever semi-official update for those issues. Not good. :-(
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
Forgot to mention an extra crappiness: it's now 1-2 days off release and Firebug was broken in
Firefox by the update earlier this week. I thought it'd be fixed by the update of today, but
it's still broken.
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
Well, at home I decided to upgrade to 8.04 a week ago. Everything was working wonderfully, but
today turned up the computer and X didn't start.
It ended up being some change that made the nvidia drivers to fail to load, which it's not too
bad because I can spent enough time without 3D, but the sound card driver also refused to
start (old soundblaster audigy).
Breaking 2 essential things for a Linux desktop in an update 48 hours before shipping isn't
making me too happy about this release.
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
Hmm. I'm assuming a lot to make this suggestion, but it sounds like you are using one of the
-386 kernels instead of the -generic kernels. I don't know what the difference between these
two is supposed to be, but the symptoms match what I got just last week when the update chose
to install a -386 kernel. (It keeps on doing this on one box and I have no idea why.)
So basically ensure you have linux-image-generic and linux-restricted-modules-generic
installed, and if it does install some new kernel then boot into that... And uninstall
everything -386 related afterwards.
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
I believe so. I thought the two were the same on x86-32.
I will try this when I get home. Thanks for the tip.
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
The Hardy server kernel won't even boot on my home server system..
"initrd extends beyond end of memory"
Still waiting for a response on bug #219868.
Seems like Ubuntu is playing into the hands of those who'd rather not see Linux succeed, which is shame after all the hard work they've clearly done.
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
Seems like Ubuntu is playing into the hands of those who'd rather not see Linux succeed,
Distros...
Distros...
Not a completely accurate description on why many departed Mandrake.
The professional version I bought didn't even let me know how badly the installation failed on
an IBM T-30 laptop. Long story ...
In desperation I tried Fedora Core 3 on the same machine, expecting serious problems. It was
a dream installations where nearly everything that I can remember just worked. [I was not so
happy with later versions.]
On the desktop, for a time I was happiest with Debian (mostly) Testing on a stable base along
with a few items from Unstable all with working dual monitor setup that was all trashed going
to 3.1.
Very reluctantly and slowly did I move to Ubuntu (5.10 an update from an unused 5.04),
compared to previous experiences it was not stellar but certainly workable with some
irritations. I too was skeptical of Ubuntu's overly enthusiastic user base. Nonetheless, I
could live with that version of Ubuntu, because other work I had to do was more important.
Moving to 6.06 in clean installs was a great improvement. However, I have been waiting for a
later version. I tend to update Firefox early. Now I cannot run even all the 3.0 betas.
They stopped working at beta 2 and beta 4 cannot even attempt to start.
It is unfortunate that the supposed long term, stable release will not live up to its name.
For now I will just upgrade to the last short term release and decide what I might try in its
place. However, Mandriva is unlikely to be the one selected due primarily to past, less than
satisfactory experiences. I should mention too that I was a Mandrake club member at the time.
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
Same for me.
My main machine has now major regressions in:
* browsing
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/213016
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/21...
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/22...
* mouse support
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/216927
(I have to ssh into my laptop and run a script to fix it...).
And some of these appeared in the past weeks.
I am supposed to make a speech this week and I am crossing my fingers, hoping that it's not
going to let me down in the middle of the talk...
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
I'm just joining the choir of people bitten by major bugs in hardy. Still, overall I'm quite
happy with ubuntu's development model. I just feel a bit uneasy about marking hardy LTS. Not
that this designation would keep me from switching to the intrepid ibex before too long :-D
No hardy kernel has ever booted on my machine:
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/180758
Can't print with firefox-3:
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox-3.0/+bu...
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
The firefox printing problem seems to have been fixed :-)
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
That third bug makes me really sad. The fix is obviously a simple kernel config setting and
the devs simply fail to apply it:
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/188226
Ubuntu 8.04 LTS server and desktop releases
A fix has been committed now.
Ubuntu 8.04 and keeping fingers crossed for good luck
I'm going to be upgrading both my machines fresh here. Then I have to do the same for my
Xwife who I still admin for. I really hope I don't have to fight a ton of bugs.
The only bugger she will have is still using MVware. Wish it would just figure out new
kernels so she didn't have to re-run install script :(
Anyway, I have had mostly very good results with u/kubuntu. The OS on this is dapper and that
says a lot!
best to all,
Ubuntu 8.04 and keeping fingers crossed for good luck
I'm guessing you mistyped MVware.
VMware is currently not in the Hardy partner repository because it's virtual network driver
(not open source) conflicts with the new 2.6.24 kernel. So it will fail to install even if you
install it manually.
Just an heads up.
I decided to give VirtualBox a look and it works for me (and it's open source).