GTK 4.0 [LWN.net]

GTK 4.0

Posted Dec 17, 2020 2:33 UTC (Thu) by flussence (guest, #85566)
In reply to: GTK 4.0 by compenguy
Parent article: GTK 4.0

>Source?
I could probably find someone stating that verbatim buried in the many 300+ comment Gnome3 flamewar threads on this very site, but here's an evergreen starting point to set the mood:
https://trac.transmissionbt.com/ticket/3685#comment:4

The whole fiasco over how CSD was mishandled is a good read. Look up why the oxygen-gtk3 theme developer burned out for a fun horror story, and further in that vein there's https://stopthemingmy.app - an entire logo-and-website to patronisingly chastise Linux users for having the audacity to think they deserve more control than Apple gives them. Or the unsettlingly possessive behaviour when gedit tried to distance itself from the project earlier this year.

You're talking past me about “rough edges” and “polish” while completely missing the point. This is about bureaucratic nastiness and the owners' tendency to fight tooth-and-nail against any attempt to improve the software by or for Outsiders, their obstinate refusal to even admit that their product can be anything less than perfect. This toxicity is what GTK has become *known* for, and it's why nobody wants to build new software in it any more - the mere fact people are choosing to go through the pain of writing non-native Qt, choosing to port major software in GTK2 to anything but GTK3 (in some cases *re-adding GTK2*), is sending a loud and clear signal that falls on deaf ears.

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GTK 4.0

Posted Dec 17, 2020 6:03 UTC (Thu) by joshl (guest, #91369) [Link] (1 responses)

> there's https://stopthemingmy.app - an entire logo-and-website to patronisingly chastise Linux users for having the audacity to think they deserve more control than Apple gives them.

In a wall of large sweeping statements, this one is interesting because it's immediately identifiable as misinformation and bunkum by following the link.

I go to the website and there's a large yellow banner telling me it's not aimed at "tinkerers playing with their own setup". I scroll down and there's bold text stating that if I want to theme my own system "that’s fine with us" with a polite warning that I shouldn't report my theme bugs upstream.

It's also curious that it's a website endorsed by people who are currently developing non-GNOME GTK apps, which apparently "nobody" wants to do.

GTK 4.0

Posted Dec 31, 2020 14:29 UTC (Thu) by flussence (guest, #85566) [Link]

>I go to the website and there's a large yellow banner telling me it's not aimed at "tinkerers playing with their own setup". I scroll down and there's bold text stating that if I want to theme my own system "that’s fine with us" with a polite warning that I shouldn't report my theme bugs upstream.

If it's aimed at distros - and not community sites like gnome-look.org - where are the distro bugs filed by these app developers, and why aren't they linked to from the page as examples?

GTK 4.0

Posted Dec 17, 2020 10:59 UTC (Thu) by pwithnall (subscriber, #97459) [Link] (1 responses)

You seem to be assuming that nothing has changed in the last decade.

GTK 4.0

Posted Jan 6, 2021 19:40 UTC (Wed) by efitton (guest, #93063) [Link]

Yes?

I mean it is the same people with the same attitudes and the same messages isn't it? I am a very external observer but my default that serves well is that you generally get the same behavior from the same group of people even ten years later. I haven't noticed any public facing change, but again, very external observer. Anyhow, it looks like the same group of people: https://blog.gtk.org/2020/12/17/who-wrote-gtk4/ and it looks primarily like GNOME a project with all that comes with that for good and for ill.