GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode [LWN.net]

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 10:42 UTC (Fri) by mmonaco (guest, #84041)
Parent article: GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

We knew it was going to happen. I guess I'm a bit tardy having a plan for my parents and grandfather who have only known the gnome2 / gnome3-fallback desktop for years. I think if someone is able to keep gnome-panel working on its own the transition might be relatively smooth. I used Openbox for a while before i3 and I'm pretty sure it can replace Metacity without anyone even noticing.

to post comments

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 10:46 UTC (Fri) by kragil (guest, #34373) [Link] (2 responses)

Most distros are packaging Mate now.

The future of Gnome3 is Gnome2.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 15:22 UTC (Fri) by jond (subscriber, #37669) [Link]

But always in addition to, not instead of, GNOME 3. And rarely as the "default" desktop, which makes a big difference. MATE do it as default. Anyone else?

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 20:09 UTC (Fri) by ovitters (guest, #27950) [Link]

As an extra or not?

A packaging/fork issue of Cinnamon resulted in a massive GNOME bug in Mageia. Basically Cinnamon didn't rename something, resulting in the auto provides/dependencies getting screwed up. At the moment there are only GNOME and KDE live cds, no MATE and no Cinnamon. To be clear: I help with Mageia and my interest is solely GNOME, as long as GNOME works I don't want to know what else is available or happening :) Cinnamon breaking GNOME (didn't start up) obviously was not something I want though ;)

I noticed MATE packaging in Fedora and Opensuse. Also Unity, but there often they packaged forked projects... which IMO is just wrong.

In any case, GNOME 2 is dead. Maybe future is MATE.. but nobody picked up on GNOME 2 (they could've, I've offered git accounts in the past).

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 11:32 UTC (Fri) by LightDot (guest, #73140) [Link] (4 responses)

Your parents or grandparents could use Mate, like mentioned, or Cinnamon. The first is a Gnome 2 fork and the second is a Gnome-shell & Gnome 3 window manager fork, with somewhat sanitized UI.

http://cinnamon.linuxmint.com/

There are of course other options, like KDE, Xfce, LXD. Or simply using a distribution that still carries and supports Gnome 2 and will do so for years to come, such as CentOS 6 or Scientific Linux 6. I do this in such cases for now.

Personally, I'm currently testing Enlightenment e17 alpha release and I'm very pleasantly surprised.

I should mention that I reasonably like Gnome-shell too. But I strongly dislike the general attitude of the project towards user suggestions and the butchering of existing UI functionality. Their "improvements" of Nautilus file manager UI were what finally did it for me.

Then again, there would be no Cinnamon without this, no Nemo without them "working" on Nautilus. Competition is a good thing and all this is a showcase for open source approach to software.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 12:07 UTC (Fri) by tao (subscriber, #17563) [Link]

As long as I can use Nemo instead of Nautilus I don't really mind gnome-shell (apart from their totally unfathomable 1-dimensional dynamic workspace; WTH were they thinking?!). Sadly Nemo isn't packaged for Debian, so I've put Nautilus on hold right now, to ensure that I don't inadvertently cripple it by "up"grading.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 16:08 UTC (Fri) by dashesy (guest, #74652) [Link]

I am using Cinnamon on Fedora now for quite some time and am very happy with it, the look is impressive and the workflow is neat. I do not understand why not every Windows user has switched to Cinnamon already, after Windows 8 disaster.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 17:47 UTC (Fri) by tjc (guest, #137) [Link]

> Personally, I'm currently testing Enlightenment e17 alpha release and I'm very pleasantly surprised.

I'm waiting for the stable release.

I haven't used E since the Red Hat days (was that 6?), so I'm looking forward to trying it again.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 17:52 UTC (Fri) by mmonaco (guest, #84041) [Link]

Wow, nice job Cinnamon folks. My parents/grandparents can definitely use this. Now if only the LightDM guys hadn't changed the gtk-greeter to a drop down menu.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 17:44 UTC (Fri) by tjc (guest, #137) [Link] (9 responses)

> We knew it was going to happen.

Call me cynical, but I suspect this was "Plan A" from the start.

But I'm not complaining -- I quite like Cinnamon on top of Gnome 3.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 18:16 UTC (Fri) by intgr (subscriber, #39733) [Link] (8 responses)

> Call me cynical, but I suspect this was "Plan A" from the start.

"Cynical"? "Suspect"? What's wrong with you people?! You make it sound like developing GNOME 3 was a big conspiracy with the only goal of conning people into using the fallback mode and then drop that when users expect it the least. And now you're saying "I told you so! I suspected it from the start!" :)

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 20:49 UTC (Fri) by sionescu (subscriber, #59410) [Link] (3 responses)

It's a very reasonable thing to suspect, that the GNOME devs tried to lure users who disliked the new UI with the promise that an old-style UI would be always available, while actually intending to renege on that promise as soon as possible.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 23:18 UTC (Fri) by ebassi (subscriber, #54855) [Link] (2 responses)

[citation needed]

i.e. cite your sources, or cut the bullshit.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 10, 2012 13:30 UTC (Sat) by sionescu (subscriber, #59410) [Link] (1 responses)

No citation is needed. In my experience of human affairs and product marketing, this is a tactic often used; therefore I suspect the GNOME developers of having used it.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 22, 2012 16:37 UTC (Thu) by TRauMa (guest, #16483) [Link]

No citation is needed. In my experience of human affairs and society, unnecessary cruelty is a human trait often experienced; therefore I suspect the you of torturing babies.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 23:51 UTC (Fri) by tjc (guest, #137) [Link] (3 responses)

> What's wrong with you people?!

Well, speaking for myself, I'm a dinosaur that doesn't want my desktop to look (and act) like a giant smartphone.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 10, 2012 4:26 UTC (Sat) by ncm (guest, #165) [Link] (2 responses)

Why can't anybody make a phone that's as easy to use as a computer?

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 18, 2012 17:06 UTC (Sun) by Jandar (subscriber, #85683) [Link] (1 responses)

“I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my telephone. My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my telephone.”
- Bjarne Stroustrup, the designer and original implementer of C++

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 24, 2012 7:31 UTC (Sat) by steffen780 (guest, #68142) [Link]

You and Bjarne made my day! :D

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 19:12 UTC (Fri) by luya (subscriber, #50741) [Link] (1 responses)

Thinking that either parents and grand-parents cannot use a desktop environment like Gnome Shell 3.8 could describe the narrowness of some users who train them. How about simply let them try the new shell to see if they either like it or not while staying objective as possible?
Some parents or grand-parents adapt faster than these users know despite complaints. Gnome Shell takes full advantage of keyboard + mouse combination.

GNOME 3.8 to drop fallback mode

Posted Nov 9, 2012 21:14 UTC (Fri) by nicku (subscriber, #777) [Link]

How about simply let them try the new shell to see if they either like it or not while staying objective as possible? Some parents or grand-parents adapt faster than these users know despite complaints.

My wife and teenage son adapted to Gnome 3 happily, and were disappointed when I set their desktops to XFCE or KDE while dealing with an early Gnome + display hardware bug. They genuinely like it, much to my surprise. On the other hand, I've used XFCE for years.