Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types [LWN.net]

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 4, 2011 17:16 UTC (Fri) by zlynx (guest, #2285)
Parent article: Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Losing fall-back mode is not a loss.

If users want to use the older style desktop, a quick Google search found people with Gnome3 ports of gnome-panel. I'm sure Nautilus hasn't completely lost the ability to display desktop icons either. And if it has, the patch to put that back in can't be very complicated.

Personally I'd switch to XFCE if I wanted a different Gnomeish experience.

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Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 4, 2011 18:32 UTC (Fri) by Cyberax (✭ supporter ✭, #52523) [Link] (13 responses)

>I'm sure Nautilus hasn't completely lost the ability to display desktop icons either.

That would be fixed in the next release in favor of displaying 'scribbles' consisting of mouse-drawn sketches of documents pulled from users' Facebook pages and shared over the Twitter. Or am I confusing GNOME3 with KDE?

Anyway, the attitude of developers: "Use Gnome Shell or GTFO" is kinda shocking.

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 5, 2011 1:33 UTC (Sat) by gmaxwell (guest, #30048) [Link]

Yea it used to be "You're just resistant to change and ignorant about your own needs", "Use Gnome Shell or GTFO" is a shocking attitude improvement.

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 6, 2011 15:45 UTC (Sun) by ovitters (guest, #27950) [Link] (11 responses)

More like: s/or GTFO/ if you want/.

Your assumption of knowing the attitude of GNOME developers seems to be incorrect. General attidue is NOT "GTFO".

See https://live.gnome.org/CodeOfConduct for how developers are supposed to behave. Some might not always behave in the best way, but saying that the general attitude is GTFO is wrong.

I don't like acronymns like GTFO. I don't see it used within GNOME.

That GNOME develops and provides GNOME shell. Well, we're not developing KDE/XFCE. Seems totally logical.

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 6, 2011 18:06 UTC (Sun) by Cyberax (✭ supporter ✭, #52523) [Link] (10 responses)

That's what I'm getting from reading discussions. GNOME3 developers venerate GNOME Shell and just couldn't understand why somebody wouldn't want to use it.

That leads to the attitude "GNOME Shell or switch to other projects".

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 7, 2011 1:12 UTC (Mon) by drag (guest, #31333) [Link] (9 responses)

That's like saying Linux kernel developers are being closed minded because they don't feel like porting all their driver work over to FreeBSD or Windows.

I don't see what is so horrible about a group of free software developers choosing what they want to spend their time working on.

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 7, 2011 2:01 UTC (Mon) by Cyberax (✭ supporter ✭, #52523) [Link] (8 responses)

Not really, that's like saying that Linux developers refuse to implement functionality requested by users instead telling them to GTFO and reimplement all the userspace.

Which is actually happing right now.

However, kernel developers seem to recognize that maybe (just maybe) it's worth to listen to users and not insist on making them to rewrite all the software to suit kernel developers' tastes.

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 7, 2011 14:04 UTC (Mon) by coulamac (guest, #21690) [Link] (7 responses)

Hold on. The GNOME 3 developers designed their next generation desktop to be *much more configurable* than its predecessor. Why did they do that? So that power users could tweak the appearance and behavior of the desktop to their hearts' content. Those same developers are finalizing a framework to make it easier for users to locate, download, and install these extensions for use with the desktop. Why are they doing this? FOR THE USERS! Do you want the GNOME3 desktop to run almost identically to the GNOME 2.x series? Use the extensions (or create them where they do not exist) to make that happen. Look what the Mint distribution is doing with MGSE to offer a "classic Gnome" experience.

The GNOME 3 developers made the conscious decision to put more power in the hands of power users to alter the desktop experience. Then they created a default which they felt would significantly improve the desktop experience for the rest of the users. You don't like their default? Fine. Then download the extensions that will make you happy, create them where they do not exist, or pay a developer to create them for you. But don't disparage the Gnome developers for allegedly hating/ignoring their users. That is a disservice to everything they have tried to achieve.

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 7, 2011 17:26 UTC (Mon) by bronson (subscriber, #4806) [Link]

So, to have a desktop that works the way current Gnome users would expect, I need to spend days searching for, writing, and funding extensions? Am I understanding your argument correctly?

To determine if it's a disservice or not, one would have to understand exactly what it is that Gnome 3 developers are trying to achieve. Maybe you could say a bit more here? From the outside, it looks like they're trying to put a tablet-like UI onto every computer of every screen size and configuration...?

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 7, 2011 18:16 UTC (Mon) by sorpigal (subscriber, #36106) [Link] (5 responses)

If the GNOME 3 platform were really so nicely flexible the first project on top of it should have been a clone of the GNOME 2 environment. The next step is the next-gen GNOME Shell stuff, which users can then use or not.

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 8, 2011 4:31 UTC (Tue) by luya (subscriber, #50741) [Link] (3 responses)

Gnome-shell was already available in 2008 as preview. The plan was already set in advance through different mainstream system news. GTK3, CSS, Javascript are tool for third part to port their applications to the newer architectures.
Gnome 2 was a total mess full of unmaintained hacks it would be ridiculous to fully replicate the same behaviour on Gnome 3 which provide a much cleaner core.

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 8, 2011 15:14 UTC (Tue) by bronson (subscriber, #4806) [Link]

Is that a false dichotomy? It doesn't seem like anyone's asking for bit-for-bit Gnome2 compatibility, just a less ambitious UI transition.

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 10, 2011 14:44 UTC (Thu) by uravanbob (guest, #4050) [Link]

I especially liked the hack that allowed me to run multiple VMs in multiple desktops on multiple displays. FWIW, I am looking forward to the time when GNOME 3 reaches a level where I can once again satisfy my use case - Until then I've had to investigate alternative DE's (sorry, not really happy with any of them, once thought E17 would be there) alternative distributions, talk about messing with workflow... finally, just installing what used to work and turning off updates (get my update fix via Android now :-) until that happy moment arrives. So I don't really have a problem with the revolution of GNOME 3, but from my perspective it could have been handled better - ala gp to this post.

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 16, 2011 21:38 UTC (Wed) by cmccabe (guest, #60281) [Link]

VOGON CAPTAIN:
Theres no point in acting all surprised about it. All the planning charts and demolition orders have been on display at your local planning department in Alpha Centauri for fifty of your Earth years so youve had plenty of time to lodge any formal complaints and its far too late to start making a fuss about it now.

What do you mean youve never been to Alpha Centauri? Oh for heaven sake mankind its only four light years away you know! Im sorry but if you cant be bothered to take an interest in local affairs thats your own regard. Energise the demolition beams! God I dont knowapathetic bloody planet, Ive no sympathy at all...

Scene 7: Ext. Space.
The Earth is destroyed in a huge explosion.

Sorry... I just couldn't resist.

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 8, 2011 18:48 UTC (Tue) by vonbrand (guest, #4458) [Link]

That there are some people complaining loudly doesn't mean that they are up to the task of creating the "Gnome 2 clone" (or even that they really are interested in such a beast).

Rawhide gets GNOME Shell for all display types

Posted Nov 16, 2011 22:15 UTC (Wed) by cas (guest, #52554) [Link]

If users want to use the older style desktop, a quick Google search found people with Gnome3 ports of gnome-panel.

i've been searching for this (on and off) for months. a quick Google search (or even a long google searching session) hasn't revealed its existence, let alone its location. All i can ever find are links to articles about fallback mode. Where can i find the port of gnome-panel to gnome 3?