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The dark side of open source conferences

The dark side of open source conferences

Posted Dec 2, 2010 12:27 UTC (Thu) by alankila (guest, #47141)
In reply to: The dark side of open source conferences by aleXXX
Parent article: The dark side of open source conferences

By this point the language on that page has got so diluted as to seem meaningless. Cis-privilege? Trans-phobia? Oh dear. I'm pretty sure this is "phobia" in same sense that "racism" is about race these days.

What is the ultimate aim for the people who wish to dilute the concept of gender? Because I can't make heads or tails out of this.


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The dark side of open source conferences

Posted Dec 2, 2010 16:14 UTC (Thu) by graydon (guest, #5009) [Link]

You certainly can make heads or tails of it. You're just choosing not to, in order to avoid having to accommodate others in a way that they claim is important to them, and you claim is irrelevant to you.

There's a word for that: rude.

The dark side of open source conferences

Posted Dec 2, 2010 19:03 UTC (Thu) by alankila (guest, #47141) [Link]

Thanks for explaining a lot in your response. You do not call your response rude, then?

The dark side of open source conferences

Posted Dec 2, 2010 21:27 UTC (Thu) by graydon (guest, #5009) [Link]

I'm rude because you're derailing. Let's count the ways.

Trivializing the topic as not-so-bad, so ignorable: check.

Conspiracy theory about the ultimate aims of people requesting civility and respect: check.

The supposedly confusing nature of the topic means you can't even google the terms you're supposedly confused about, and need me to read the internet aloud to you: check.

My rude tone in response excuses yours so there's no problem: check.

No, not acceptable. Go read on your own and try again.

The dark side of open source conferences

Posted Dec 2, 2010 22:44 UTC (Thu) by nye (guest, #51576) [Link]

You should be ashamed of your behaviour.

The dark side of open source conferences

Posted Dec 2, 2010 23:37 UTC (Thu) by graydon (guest, #5009) [Link]

I'm ashamed that a place I associate so commonly produces threads like this.

What do you think I should be ashamed of?

The dark side of open source conferences

Posted Dec 2, 2010 19:33 UTC (Thu) by nye (guest, #51576) [Link]

Redefining commonly used words to mean something new and then attacking others for not understanding and using your new definition could also be considered rude.

The dark side of open source conferences

Posted Dec 8, 2010 9:05 UTC (Wed) by k8to (subscriber, #15413) [Link]

I don't believe that happened.

The dark side of open source conferences

Posted Dec 3, 2010 5:30 UTC (Fri) by njs (guest, #40338) [Link]

> By this point the language on that page has got so diluted as to seem meaningless. Cis-privilege? Trans-phobia? Oh dear. I'm pretty sure this is "phobia" in same sense that "racism" is about race these days.

That is an excellent bit of deduction you have performed, determining what people who have lived through stuff mean on a subject that you admit you have no knowledge of whatsoever.

Seriously, even if you don't have any trans friends who are willing to explain this stuff (like they have to do every day), there is this thing called the internet. If you want to learn what it's like to be trans, you can find that out really easily.

I do admit that your approach (make decision, *then* acquire facts) is quicker, though.

> What is the ultimate aim for the people who wish to dilute the concept of gender? Because I can't make heads or tails out of this.

To live their lives, I think. (Note: their lives are different from your life.)

The dark side of open source conferences

Posted Dec 3, 2010 19:55 UTC (Fri) by AdamW (subscriber, #48457) [Link]

thought experiment, here: if you came across a new programming language or a new startup process or a new desktop environment and it used some terms you weren't familiar with, would you:

a) immediately decide that it was some kind of politically-correct conspiracy theory and the new terms were just silly jargon

b) look up the terms and figure out what they meant

Hmm, tricky one, there. Areas of interest tend to generate their own vocabulary. We talk about 'shared libraries' because we don't want to rewrite 'compilations of common functions that can be used by multiple external pieces of code' too often. To someone outside the field, 'shared library' is either a meaningless piece of jargon or a place you can go and get books. Are we muddle-headed politically correct conspiracies nuts? No, we're a special interest group with its own vocabulary. Why is it such a problem when the interest in question is prejudice against minority genders?

The dark side of open source conferences

Posted Dec 3, 2010 21:35 UTC (Fri) by alankila (guest, #47141) [Link]

I did spend some time looking through this stuff after I made my original comment that was the first time I hit these terms. My bewilderment was of course treated as some kind of calculated insult rather than understood by the people who directly responded to me.

I learnt a few things, along those the primary understanding that there is nothing I could possibly say that would not be attacked on this topic, because I fundamentally do not use language the same way that people do who care about this topic. It's easier just to let it slide.

The dark side of open source conferences

Posted Dec 4, 2010 15:27 UTC (Sat) by ofeeley (subscriber, #36105) [Link]

So, you've been busy using the phrases you pointed out "cis-privilege" and "transphobia" for a while and hear them used in other contexts commonly and thus came away bewildered? Poor thing. Someone is obviously trying to make your head spin.


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