Chromium OS source released [LWN.net]

Chromium OS source released

Posted Nov 19, 2009 20:06 UTC (Thu) by elanthis (guest, #6227)
Parent article: Chromium OS source released

::roll eyes::

More nonsense with idealists out of touch with reality that think that there's any user on this planet that only uses the Web and nothing else.

No business has a use for this.

The vast majority of kids, teenagers, college students, and young adults have a use for this.

Most families and grandparents and crazy old aunts have no use for this.

Here in Reality Land, people use quite a large variety of non-Web apps. Many, many people buy a computer just to use a specific non-Web app (often games, high-end office software that Google Apps comes nowhere close to competing with, movie and multimedia software no Web page can do, or software requires for school or work).

The only time any Web app has even come close to competing with traditional desktop apps is when that Web app is delivered as a custom plugin, which itself is nothing more than a traditional desktop app that requires a browser chrome around it to work (which in turn is just stupid an a waste of everyone's time, and is done only because so many OSes make it easy to install arbitrary third-party executable code into a browser but go out of their way to make installing arbitrary third-party executable code outside of a browser a pain in the ass... e.g. Linux).

to post comments

Chromium OS source released

Posted Nov 19, 2009 20:18 UTC (Thu) by drag (guest, #31333) [Link] (15 responses)

Q: What is the major differences between Chrome OS and running Windows with
Chrome Browser?

A: You can't run any of your Windows applications.

Q: What is the major thing you can do in Chrome OS that you can't do in
Windows with Chrome Browser?

A: Probably nothing; except it boots slightly faster.

Who might use Chromium OS?

Posted Nov 19, 2009 21:07 UTC (Thu) by dwheeler (guest, #1216) [Link] (12 responses)

Clearly, there are a lot of users that Chromium OS won't satisfy. But the article does list potential advantages of it:

"... users do not have to deal with installing, managing and updating programs". Yeah, computer experts find this to be a non-problem, but I think there ARE users who would LIKE this.
"... there are significant benefits to security... Each app is contained within a security sandbox making it harder for malware and viruses to infect your computer... (and) If your system has been compromised, it is designed to fix itself with a reboot." If you've had to fix a Windows system after an infection, you'll appreciate this.
"you can go from turning on the computer to surfing the web in a few seconds." Windows systems do NOT do this, at all.

It's hard to guess how large this market is, but it's not completely crazy. It'll be interesting to see.

Who might use Chromium OS?

Posted Nov 19, 2009 21:48 UTC (Thu) by drag (guest, #31333) [Link] (9 responses)

But the problem is that Google is not going to sacrifice the ad revenue by
forcing people to use Chrome OS to use their online services; and neither is
anybody else.

So everything that you described will still work with Chrome browser on
Windows or normal Linux desktop. Maybe people will have to manage their own
bookmarks or something like that, but that is about it. Ergo they get just
about all the same positive experiences with Windows + Chrome Browser (or
pretty much any other other browser) with the ability to run their normal
applications.

So by going to a browser-centric OS they have to give up a lot of stuff with
very little gain with just sticking with a regular OS and using a browser.

Users and maintainers

Posted Nov 19, 2009 22:39 UTC (Thu) by dmarti (subscriber, #11625) [Link] (4 responses)

Users and buyers aren't necessarily the same. If you're the Family Computer Person, having your web-centric users on a machine that won't run malware or p2p takes a burden away from you. "I know I promised you a computer for your birthday, but after your brother got us fifteen viruses, two identity thefts, and an RIAA lawsuit, you're getting a Google box."

Users and maintainers

Posted Nov 19, 2009 22:53 UTC (Thu) by drag (guest, #31333) [Link] (3 responses)

Maybe.

I am just not convinced. In order for this to have merit it's going to have
to be hella slick. It's going to have to be so nice and so intuitive that
people are not going to want to run familiar software they already know and
understand.

It's going to be exceptionally difficult for them to pull this one off.

Users and maintainers

Posted Nov 19, 2009 23:46 UTC (Thu) by anselm (subscriber, #2796) [Link] (1 responses)

I don't think that, realistically, Google's goal is to replace every single PC in existence with a machine running Chromium OS. (They probably wouldn't mind if that happened but hey, I'd like a pony, too.) There are still loads of people around who haven't touched a computer for their entire lives so far, and so have no preconceived notion of how software should look like and behave. If Google manages to rope in just an appreciable fraction of those they'll be more than comfortable for a user community.

Also, people are moving in droves from their local mail programs to Google Mail in a browser already. As it turns out, Google Mail is kinda slick. And if e-mail and web surfing are the main things they do on their computer, which again holds true for a fairly significant number of people, Google's approach will probably be just fine for them.

kids today

Posted Nov 20, 2009 0:41 UTC (Fri) by dmarti (subscriber, #11625) [Link]

These kids today are riding bikes with only one gear, using the one-channel Twitter instead of IRC, drinking PBR -- why not a one-application computer?

Users and maintainers

Posted Nov 20, 2009 20:45 UTC (Fri) by asherringham (guest, #33251) [Link]

I don't think the bar is that high really.

My mum is very computer illiterate and has trouble with the concept of a "window" or "desktop" and finds the trackpad and keyboard hard. I have to repeatedly remind her how to use the "Enter" key ("the BIG key!") to break up long lines.

But guess what? She runs Linux!

This is an older laptop - web browsing and web mail only. She really doesn't need anything else and I don't have to worry about viruses, trojans and assorted malware. No need for slick - just very basic functionality.

Alastair

Who might use Chromium OS?

Posted Nov 20, 2009 10:12 UTC (Fri) by xav (guest, #18536) [Link] (3 responses)

Like for Android, Google will share its ad revenues with OEM accepting to deliver the full Chrome OS (including proprietary Google apps) on their netbooks.
That's where they'll beat Microsoft: not only will they be cheaper than Windows, they'll even have a negative cost.

Who might use Chromium OS?

Posted Nov 20, 2009 15:34 UTC (Fri) by kragil (guest, #34373) [Link] (2 responses)

Exactly "Less than free".

How much will an 1+GHZ + ARM SOC + 512 MB RAM and a 2 GB SDD + small battery + an 1280 x 800 display and a few wires and plastic cost at the of 2010?

Not more than $200.

So these things will beat Windows machines everywhere except maybe really rich countries.

Like Android, this is huge.

Who might use Chromium OS?

Posted Nov 20, 2009 16:10 UTC (Fri) by dion (guest, #2764) [Link] (1 responses)

Well, it's not quite your specs, but the price is $80 today:
http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Menq-Easypc-E790/

I think the Chomium OS is more likely to be used in stead of Android on the super-low end netbooks, webpads and what have you, it's not really meant to replace any "real" machines.

However, if history has taught us anything, then it's that todays "rinky dink toys" will be tomorrows mainstream and that anybody who sells "real computers" and ignores the toy end of the market will soon perish.

Who might use Chromium OS?

Posted Nov 20, 2009 16:30 UTC (Fri) by lysse (guest, #3190) [Link]

If someone were to sell me one of those for £50, I'd grab the first one into the country! Unfortunately, the nearest equivalents never really dip much below £120 - and at that price (when refurbished Eees can be had for £110) it's just not worth it.

Who might use Chromium OS?

Posted Nov 23, 2009 10:56 UTC (Mon) by salimma (subscriber, #34460) [Link] (1 responses)

The boot-up time is a non-issue for Moblin, which boots in 5 seconds. And you can install Chromium (the browser) on Moblin too.

Who might use Chromium OS?

Posted Nov 23, 2009 12:12 UTC (Mon) by kragil (guest, #34373) [Link]

Which DID boot in 5 seconds(seems to have become slower AFAICT) on modified hardware or from the bootloader. (I have the EeePC that they demoed the 5 second boot and the BIOS takes a lot of time.)

ChromeOS does that from the moment you press the power button, that is very different.

Chromium OS source released

Posted Nov 19, 2009 22:14 UTC (Thu) by wmf (guest, #33791) [Link] (1 responses)

Given Google's "less than free" business model, we should expect Chrome OS netbooks to be cheaper than Windows netbooks. (Of course, we've been expecting Linux to be cheaper than Windows for many years and it hasn't happened yet.)

"crapware"

Posted Nov 19, 2009 22:32 UTC (Thu) by dmarti (subscriber, #11625) [Link]

Don't forget that a typical Microsoft Windows box these days comes with a bunch of preinstalled "crapware" -- paid positioning of trial versions of proprietary software. PC manufacturers are already used to getting paid to put stuff on the machine.

Chromium OS source released

Posted Nov 19, 2009 21:11 UTC (Thu) by massysett (guest, #52736) [Link] (2 responses)

"More nonsense with idealists out of touch with reality that think that there's any user on this planet that only uses the Web and nothing else."

You seem to be assuming that people have only one computer, or that people are interested in using the desktop apps on every computer they have, or that the market is frozen in its current state and that people will always be wedded to their desktop apps just because they are now.

I can picture many a user buying one of these machines as an extra, assuming the price is right.

Also, as the web apps mature I don't doubt people will use them more. It is amazing how far they have come in terms of usability.

Chromium OS source released

Posted Nov 19, 2009 23:36 UTC (Thu) by fb (guest, #53265) [Link] (1 responses)

> I can picture many a user buying one of these machines as an extra, assuming the price is right.

I can see myself buying one.

At home I have a desktop, laptop (15"), and an Android phone. However uncomfortable it is to read RSS feeds, and email in a 3.2" screen, more often than I would ever have expected I find myself doing these things on the phone.

The reason is simple: the phone is always on, while the other two are things I need to "decide" to turn on.

I am also uninclined to leave my laptop on. The vent kicks in, and Gnome always wakes the disk. Suspending the system is not as reliable I'd wish it to be.

No case for Chromium OS

Posted Nov 21, 2009 16:32 UTC (Sat) by man_ls (guest, #15091) [Link]

The cynical in me says you need a new netbook with XFCE. My Eee 1000H fits your use case beautifully; I have fine-grained control of the fan and with

echo 80 > /sys/class/hwmon/hwmon1/pwm1

it is barely audible. And you can hook it up to a big-ass monitor. Just be sure to stay clear of that horrible Poulsbo mess and similar binary-only fiascos.

Chromium OS source released

Posted Nov 20, 2009 6:11 UTC (Fri) by b7j0c (guest, #27559) [Link]

there's a huge audience for this

there are five hundred million people around the world who use their computer to read email, search, watch youtube and use facebook

this audience is vastly larger than the audience of ms office users, photoshop users and even gamers

google is on to something. casual networked users are going to hit 1 billion+ users in the next decade.

i see lots of potential in a networked OS. go sit at someone else's desk, log in, boom...your desktop

advanced canvas and webgl will narrow the graphical/interactive gap

in ten years only a few native desktop apps will still be needed

apple and microsoft will invariably have to follow this model, its where the money will be.

Chromium OS source released

Posted Nov 20, 2009 8:56 UTC (Fri) by TRS-80 (guest, #1804) [Link] (2 responses)

If nothing else, any VOIP app is going to be native - Flash or HTML5 aren't serious contenders (yes, I know Flash 10 has RTMFP, it doesn't seem to be designed for regular VOIP).

Reading the docs, if you turn off verified boot/turn on dev mode you should be able to alter the filesystem and install apps. Probably even install .debs, given it's based on Ubuntu, although I can't tell whether they'd need to be rebuilt.

Also in the docs is the claim the user will have a second PC if recovery is required, so maybe they are positioning this as a true netbook, secondary to your main computer.

Chromium OS source released

Posted Nov 24, 2009 12:02 UTC (Tue) by jospoortvliet (guest, #33164) [Link] (1 responses)

I dunno, doesn't google mail already have voice & video chat? At least it seems to offer those... Haven't used them (yet) but it's there.

Chromium OS source released

Posted Nov 24, 2009 14:02 UTC (Tue) by TRS-80 (guest, #1804) [Link]

It does, but it uses a native plugin, which incidentally isn't available for Linux (yet).

Re: nobody has a use for this

Posted Nov 20, 2009 9:22 UTC (Fri) by edmundo (guest, #616) [Link]

None of us is really familiar with all of the general public. We all interact with just a biased specimen of it. However, I would have thought there must be quite a lot of people who would be happy with just a browser. Consider the following person, for example. Outside work she uses a computer only for the web browser (shopping, Google Mail, ...). When she's working at home she has to use various Microsoft apps, but neither her current employer nor her previous employer would allow her move documents off their server, so she has to work online with her PC acting as a terminal. With her previous job she used Cisco Terminal Server, I think it was: it worked fine on my Linux box. With her current job she uses some kind of Java-based thing that runs within the browser: it would probably run on Linux, though I've not tried it.

Needing a network connection is a disadvantage, it's true. But being able to work from several different computers and knowing that you have lost no data whatsoever if your computer catches fire or is stolen is a significant advantage.

The work she does involves spreading out confidential paper documents over a reasonably large table. She couldn't work on an aeroplane even if she did have to fly, which she doesn't.

Chromium OS source released

Posted Nov 20, 2009 13:37 UTC (Fri) by Los__D (guest, #15263) [Link]

It seems more like you are the idealist out of touch with reality.

90% (yes, completely dreamed up figure, but I'm pretty sure it's close) of computer users doesn't care about anything but their browser, reading mail and editing documents.