|
|
Log in / Subscribe / Register

Microsoft launches open source foundation (Linux-Watch)

Microsoft launches open source foundation (Linux-Watch)

Posted Sep 12, 2009 12:47 UTC (Sat) by trasz (guest, #45786)
In reply to: Microsoft launches open source foundation (Linux-Watch) by nix
Parent article: Microsoft launches open source foundation (Linux-Watch)

No, let me repeat. When some company takes BSD code from some project and creates its own, closed-source fork, there is a non-zero probability that this company will hire developers from the project and return code that is not a selling point for them. That happens a lot - from PostgreSQL to FreeBSD to Xorg. That's symbiosis.

When GPL-ed project takes BSD code from some project and creates its own, GPL-ed fork, there is zero probability of the original project getting anything in return. This just doesn't happen - for variety of reasons, one of which is that the GPL license prohibits incorporating changes back to the BSD-licensed code. That's not a symbiosis.


to post comments

Microsoft launches open source foundation (Linux-Watch)

Posted Sep 12, 2009 13:47 UTC (Sat) by xilun (guest, #50638) [Link] (1 responses)

Except that that does indeed sometimes happen, when BSD devs ask kindly (or not so kindly...)

Microsoft launches open source foundation (Linux-Watch)

Posted Sep 12, 2009 14:54 UTC (Sat) by trasz (guest, #45786) [Link]

Could you provide some example? I seem to remember problems with even more trivial stuff, for example GCC developers not wanting to relicense patch fixing some bug from GPLv3 to GPLv2.

Microsoft launches open source foundation (Linux-Watch)

Posted Sep 13, 2009 9:51 UTC (Sun) by njs (subscriber, #40338) [Link] (1 responses)

I've certainly contributed code back to BSD-licensed libraries under a BSD license, when I needed the functionality for my GPL'ed work on top.

I believe that's exactly what you're claiming only proprietary companies do?

Microsoft launches open source foundation (Linux-Watch)

Posted Sep 14, 2009 7:59 UTC (Mon) by trasz (guest, #45786) [Link]

No. I'm not talking about merely using BSD code by GPL-ed projects, just like I'm not talking about merely using BSD code in closed source projects. What I'm talking is created GPL-licensed forks of BSD code and closed-source forks of BSD code.

Microsoft launches open source foundation (Linux-Watch)

Posted Sep 13, 2009 14:55 UTC (Sun) by clump (subscriber, #27801) [Link]

No, let me repeat. When some company takes BSD code from some project and creates its own, closed-source fork, there is a non-zero probability that this company will hire developers from the project and return code that is not a selling point for them. That happens a lot - from PostgreSQL to FreeBSD to Xorg. That's symbiosis.
"This happens a lot" is a pretty thin broth to serve. It's nowhere close to being required by the license to make changes available.
When GPL-ed project takes BSD code from some project and creates its own, GPL-ed fork, there is zero probability of the original project getting anything in return. This just doesn't happen - for variety of reasons, one of which is that the GPL license prohibits incorporating changes back to the BSD-licensed code. That's not a symbiosis.
Zero probablility? This is completely false. You seem to be arguing that since companies that make proprietary code from BSD *can* return code, they *will* return code. Yet your anti-GPL arguments miss the point that GPL code *can* be dual-licensed... allowing them to be used by ... BSD-licensed projects. Need an example? Hostap. Look at NJS's comment as well.

You don't appear to be saying anything on-topic, I might add. It's as if you've been asleep for nine years and woke up fresh to bring the year 2000's favorite dead horse back for new kicks.

Microsoft launches open source foundation (Linux-Watch)

Posted Sep 14, 2009 8:39 UTC (Mon) by hppnq (guest, #14462) [Link]

What annoys me a bit about this whole discussion, is that it is not so difficult to understand the BSD and GPL licenses, and why they are there. In either case, getting anything back other than the warmness that comes from releasing Free Software is not part of the deal. If you are in this business then go write proprietary code, force people to love you or pay their respect or whatever it is that you want, and be happy.

Stop complaining that people make use of the freedom that you have yourself stipulated in your license. This is incredibly stupid, even if someone like Theo de Raadt seems to think differently. I say this because obviously, this is especially true for people who have chosen the BSD license to release code: it permits using it in a GPL project. Whatever happens in the real world is part of the process that leads to chosing the license, it's not the other way around.

Microsoft launches open source foundation (Linux-Watch)

Posted Sep 15, 2009 8:30 UTC (Tue) by dgm (subscriber, #49227) [Link]

I think this is the crux of the matter:
Many "BSD people" release code with the (not so) secret intention of getting hired and making money. The code is a means to that end.
Most "GPL people", on the other hand, are (A) forced to release because they are adding to a GPL'd base or (B) because they care about the code and want help from others.
That GPL'd projects enjoy a wider developer base seems a consequence of type A developers, and maybe the fact that it looks much more fair from an occasional contributor perspective (the ones that would not be hired).
And of course, users don't care much as long as the stuff works.


Copyright © 2026, Eklektix, Inc.
Comments and public postings are copyrighted by their creators.
Linux is a registered trademark of Linus Torvalds