Quotes of the week [LWN.net]

Things are going much much more smoothly now than they were in 2.6.24-rcX and 2.6.23-rcX. Tree integration problems are negligible and build errors are far fewer and runtime problems seem to be less too. Fingers crossed.

-- Andrew Morton

That is not particularly important, because Linux isn't a GNU package. If it were a GNU package, I would write to its maintainers to suggest using Bzr.

-- Richard Stallman

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Quotes of the week

Posted Mar 14, 2008 0:26 UTC (Fri) by alfille (subscriber, #1631) [Link] (15 responses)

So Linux is not a GNU package? Then shouldn't we stop the silliness of GNU/Linux?

Quotes of the week

Posted Mar 14, 2008 1:10 UTC (Fri) by lysse (guest, #3190) [Link] (5 responses)

That, sir, deserves the Babbage retort.

Quotes of the week

Posted Mar 14, 2008 13:02 UTC (Fri) by alfille (subscriber, #1631) [Link] (4 responses)

I gather you've been waiting for a chance to use that line. Not truly relevant, but the
original was clever.

I'm not eager to start a flame over this, but the point is that if GNU is a "Brand" or an
certification, then imposing it on another product sends a different message. I'm observing
that Mr. Stallman's views have either evolved, or are not consistent in this matter.

GNU/Linux terminology

Posted Mar 14, 2008 19:03 UTC (Fri) by giraffedata (guest, #1954) [Link] (2 responses)

It's all in the typography. There is a world of difference between "GNU Linux," which would refer to a GNU package, and "GNU/Linux," which describes a system created by the GNU project that includes Linux as a principle part (or possibly a combination of the GNU System and Linux).

Maybe Stallman once expected the GNU System to be composed entirely of GNU packages, but if so, then he gave that up long ago, when he saw that useful free software was being developed by others too.

GNU/Linux terminology

Posted Mar 14, 2008 20:08 UTC (Fri) by vonbrand (guest, #4458) [Link]

Maybe Stallman once expected the GNU System to be composed entirely of GNU packages, but if so, then he gave that up long ago, when he saw that useful free software was being developed by others too.

Nearly impossible, given that so many huge external pieces are part of the "GNU system" (X Window System, TeX come to mind).

GNU/Linux terminology

Posted Mar 20, 2008 15:09 UTC (Thu) by lysse (guest, #3190) [Link]

> or possibly a combination of the GNU System and Linux

We have a winner!

Quotes of the week

Posted Mar 20, 2008 15:08 UTC (Thu) by lysse (guest, #3190) [Link]

> I gather

incorrectly.

Meaning of GNU/Linux

Posted Mar 14, 2008 19:10 UTC (Fri) by speedster1 (guest, #8143) [Link] (8 responses)

GNU/Linux never was meant to imply that the Linux kernel was GNU software. It  is intended to
describe an operating system which is a collection of both the Linux kernel and many userspace
libraries and applications, where a sizeable proportion of userspace code *is* GNU software.
Note that this description does not fit ALL systems commonly referred to as "Linux", for
instance some classes of embedded Linux devices are busybox+custom apps. Although, come to
think of it, most of those embedded devices are highly dependent on GNU toolchains...

So, Stallman was not being inconsistent. Suppose I referred to my sandwich as "turkey/swiss
cheese", but also asserted that the swiss cheese is not itself turkey, and thus does not have
to be held to rules that apply to deli meat... would that be inconsistent?

Meaning of GNU/Linux

Posted Mar 14, 2008 21:00 UTC (Fri) by zlynx (guest, #2285) [Link]

Follow that pattern, I sometimes describe my system as "Gnome/X/GNU/Linux".
Some embedded systems are actually "Qt/BusyBox/Linux" or "FLTK/X/BusyBox/Linux" and there's no
GNU in there at all.

Meaning of GNU/Linux

Posted Mar 15, 2008 0:34 UTC (Sat) by alfille (subscriber, #1631) [Link] (3 responses)

So why not GNU/cygwin GNU/freeBSD, etc?

It's not that there isn't GNU included in a standard Linux distribution, it's that imposing
your name and demanding first billing smacks of jealousy. Demanding that the GNU name be added
to any distribution that includes GNU software wasn't originally required.

Meaning of GNU/Linux

Posted Mar 15, 2008 10:30 UTC (Sat) by nix (subscriber, #2304) [Link]

Of course, if we ever get embedded animal tracking chips running free 
software, we could have GNU/gnu.

Meaning of GNU/Linux

Posted Mar 15, 2008 20:45 UTC (Sat) by speedster1 (guest, #8143) [Link]

A lot of free *BSD systems use mostly BSD-derived userspace. However, haven't you heard of
"Debian GNU/kFreeBSD"?

Meaning of GNU/Linux

Posted Mar 15, 2008 20:47 UTC (Sat) by speedster1 (guest, #8143) [Link]

Oops previous comment about Debian GNU/kFreeBSD ended up under the wrong parent, sorry...

Meaning of GNU/Linux

Posted Mar 17, 2008 1:48 UTC (Mon) by alfille (subscriber, #1631) [Link] (2 responses)

>>So, Stallman was not being inconsistent. Suppose I referred to my sandwich as "turkey/swiss
cheese", but also asserted that the swiss cheese is not itself turkey, and thus does not have
to be held to rules that apply to deli meat... would that be inconsistent?


I insist that all all such sandwiches be called MAYO/swiss/turkey.

Meaning of GNU/Linux

Posted Mar 17, 2008 6:07 UTC (Mon) by speedster1 (guest, #8143) [Link] (1 responses)

I refuse to continue this conversation any more, now that you have started disgusting rumors
about my poor sandwich. Stallman would NEVER stoop to such depths as accusing me of putting
Mayo on my sandwich, whether he is jealous of Linux's fame or not.

(Mustard, well maybe, but MAYO!!???)

Meaning of GNU/Linux

Posted Mar 20, 2008 21:12 UTC (Thu) by bronson (subscriber, #4806) [Link]

Look, it's all about choice.  Biodiversity.  A sandwich monoculture, while convenient today,
ends up being harmful in the long run.  By Thursday I suspect you'll be tired of mustard...