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Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

From:  Mark Shuttleworth <mark-AT-canonical.com>
To:  ubuntu-devel-announce-AT-lists.ubuntu.com
Subject:  Proposal for additional QA and localisation time on Dapper
Date:  Fri, 10 Mar 2006 20:23:31 +0000
Cc:  fridge-devel-AT-lists.ubuntu.com, ubuntu-doc-AT-lists.ubuntu.com, The Launchpad <launchpad-AT-lists.ubuntu.com>, Ubuntu Art Team <ubuntu-art-AT-lists.ubuntu.com>

Hi all

I'm writing to propose a six week delay in the release date of Dapper,
in order to do additional validation, certification, localisation, and
polish. I would like to call for a community "town hall" meeting on
Tuesday 14th March - once at 09:00 UTC (for the Aussies and Asian
communities) and then again at 18:00 UTC (for Europe and the Americas).
The meetings will be in #ubuntu-meeting on irc.freenode.net. Based on
feedback at those meetings, we will ask the Tech Board and the Community
Council to take a view on the proposal, and announce the decision by the
end of the week.

Work towards our feature goals for Dapper is very much on target:

  https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+specs

Having good tools to track our evolution has made Dapper our
best-managed release so far. We have deferred very few goals since our
Montreal planning summit, and have been able to land some unexpected but
very nice extra features.  The new installer is looking good, so we
could in fact make our target date of April 20 if we decide that is the
most important thing.

We have a very good track record of meeting our six monthly release
dates, and that reputation is not something I want to compromise.

However, in some senses Dapper is a "first" for us, in that it is the
first "enterprise quality" release of Ubuntu, for which we plan to offer
support for a very long time. I, and others, would very much like Dapper
to stand proud amongst the traditional enterprise linux releases from
Red Hat, Debian and SUSE as an equal match on quality, support and
presentation. We would like Ubuntu Dapper to be a release that companies
can deploy with confidence, which will be the focus of certification
work from ISV's and IHV's, and which will bring the benefits of Debian
to a whole new group of users.

That's certainly a new set of challenges, and I would like to give us a
few more weeks of work on Dapper in order to make absolutely sure that
we are, for a period at least (until Etch lands :-)), the very best
enterprise desktop and server release in the world.

I would like the Tech Board to determine, if we delay the final release,
what the optimal beta, release candidate and target final release dates
should be, based on the feedback that comes in during this discussion.

Here are the concrete things I think we can gain from a delay:

  1. Testing
  The Dapper user will likely be new to Linux, and working in a more
corporate environment than previous Ubuntu release adopters. They will
likely also be given Dapper to use, rather than choosing it for
themselves, as Dapper is deployed in larger-scale environments.
Additional testing time will shake out more bugs and give us a more
robust codebase to support.

  2. Certification
  There are a number of ISV's and IHV's who are in the process of
certifying Dapper as part of their solution, and the delay will give us
an opportunity to ensure that those are ready for the release. I am
happy to say that we are working towards LSB 3.0 certification of
Dapper, and the delay greatly reduces any risk of failure to achieve
that certification.

  3. Localisation
  After the Asia business tour I realised that we need to improve our
support for Chinese, Japanese, Korean and other Asian fonts,
translations, input methods and supporting tools. We are pulling
together a crack team to work on that next week, and I would like to
land their changes in Dapper. These countries are growing their adoption
of technology at a very high speed and it would be great to offer them a
compelling alternative to the traditional route of proprietary software.
I missed the importance of this in Montreal, I confess, and so did not
prioritise the work early on in our cycle. I would like to remedy that
now, rather than waiting two or three years for another enterprise-class
Ubuntu release.

  In addition, the extra time will help us ensure that all languages
have better translations available, for the installer and the whole
desktop environment. We have just done the import of Dapper into
Rosetta, so those of you with a talent for languages will appreciate the
extra time to add depth to your language packs.

  4. Polish
  You may have noticed this weeks theming and polish changes. No, we are
not newly sponsored by Orange :-). Of course, there is a lot still to be
done, and with some extra time I think Dapper can look beautiful for
Kubuntu, Ubuntu and Xubuntu users.

Speaking of Xubuntu,  there is a main inclusion report under discussion
to make Xubuntu part of main, and to publish ISO's of Xubuntu. The extra
time makes this a more reasonable proposition.

There are many groups that are working towards Dapper's release or
dependent on it in one way or another. For example, folks who are
writing books with planned release dates, or folks doing work on
derivative distributions and hardware that needs Dapper to be available.
I would like to hear from anyone who will be impacted by this potential
change to see if we can find a way that gives the best result for the
broad community. Please send me email, and join in on the meetings at
whichever time suits you best.

We would like to be able to announce 24x7 global technical support for
Dapper, both from Canonical and from the fantastic ecosystem of
companies that is growing up around Ubuntu. We would like to show that a
Debian-based distribution can deliver the same world class desktop punch
that you might traditionally expect from Novell or Red Hat. We will live
with Dapper for five years - so let's give it a few extra weeks now so
that it can be a real asset to the Ubuntu project for the full duration
of its lifespan.

Mark

-- 
ubuntu-devel-announce mailing list
ubuntu-devel-announce@lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-an...



to post comments

Wow!

Posted Mar 11, 2006 18:27 UTC (Sat) by ncm (guest, #165) [Link]

Maybe they'll even make the panel's auto-hide mode actually auto-hide most of the time. It's happened before.

Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 11, 2006 19:20 UTC (Sat) by error27 (subscriber, #8346) [Link]

The orange theme goes well with lwn. I say they should just leave it.

Maybe one point release in April, and an official later?

Posted Mar 11, 2006 22:36 UTC (Sat) by rvfh (guest, #31018) [Link] (1 responses)

I think delay is acceptable, but why not make an 'expected to work fine' release candidate (à la Linus) in April for those who depend on the release date? Then everybody is happy!

I am using Dapper right now, and from my point of view it is already very good quality; I have seen other vendors (not cited by Mark ;-) release things that were much less ready than that!

Maybe one point release in April, and an official later?

Posted Mar 12, 2006 10:58 UTC (Sun) by irios (guest, #19838) [Link]

Be sure there would be more "Flight CD's" if the final release were postponed, with further updates via apt.

I installed Flight 3 in my portable. and it is running just fine right now, progressively morphed into Flight 5. It's fun to see it evolve every day into something ever more polished.

Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 11, 2006 23:34 UTC (Sat) by jyp (guest, #29846) [Link] (5 responses)

In spite of the fact that I am experiencing some frustrating problems with Kubuntu (no
sound in Kaffeine, scim/skim not working and some more...) and that I am eager to
see if Dapper would bring a cure, I would gladly wait a few weeks for a more
polished release.

Although I am far from being a geek, I have been using Linux exclusively for about 2
years (Suse then Debian then Ubuntu/Kubuntu) but I must say that a fair amount of
perseverance and faith was needed to keep on with it, especially when one tries to
build a web site in three languages (Traditional and Simplified Chinese, English and
French). I had to invest quite a lot of time just to be able to switch between English
and French keyboard (the cure was a symlink to be define in /etc/X11/xkb/) and we
unfortunately had to rely on a MS machine to input the Chinese. So my Chinese
friends are for the moment being still in the MS world; what a pity.

BTW, it would also be a nice opportunity to synchronize the releases of
Ubuntu/Kubuntu with the summer and the winter solstices!


Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 12, 2006 9:13 UTC (Sun) by job (guest, #670) [Link] (2 responses)

Couldn't you use the kxkb applet to switch layouts?

Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 12, 2006 17:24 UTC (Sun) by jyp (guest, #29846) [Link] (1 responses)

After a fresh install of Kubuntu Breezy, the keyboard layout window was empty
(System setting > Regional & Accessibility > Keyboard layout); after reading many
forum posts I found a cure: create a symlink (/usr/share/X11/xkb -> /etc/X11/xkb).

Now the keyboard layout window was offering choices and I selected
Canada_french; the little icon appeared in the system tray; but I still cannot
manage to make the switch-keyboard shorcut works; I have to use the mouse
which is annoying.

The Kaffeine problem: before the fresh install, I had sound. Now no sound. But this
problem is much less of a problem for me than the scim/skim problem.

I am putting much hope in Dapper even if it is released later; better later and
better.

Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 12, 2006 23:38 UTC (Sun) by mepr (guest, #4819) [Link]

i believe your chinese support problem will be fixed if you install the following packages, plus the ones apt will recommend when you apt-get install:

kde-i18n-zhcn language-support-zh language-support-zh-cn language-pack-zh

the command "apt-cache search language-support" will show you all of the available languages.

Now, I tried this myself for japanese on a dapper install, because I was having the same problem.. only english was appearing in the kde-panel's internationalization. And the problem was solved. KDE's system-settings->Regional & Accessibility->Add Language now shows Japanese as an option. Now, as for keyboard layout, I don't know what to say, because Japanese was already listed as a keyboard layout choice. But perhaps I had already installed some other relevant packages.

As I said, that was on dapper, but my non-gui breezy badger server has those same packages available, and I would guess they would likewise fix the problem.
Note: i didn't notice the chinese packages at first because they are using zh instead of the cn that I expected.

Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 12, 2006 17:30 UTC (Sun) by ngiger@mus.ch (subscriber, #4013) [Link]

As my wife is from Korea I also had to setup a solution to enable her to
input korean/hangul. My solution was to create some shortcuts on the
Desktop for the program my wife needs to give input in korean (KMail and
OpenOffice) while still having all the menus in german.
As Input Manager I use Amy, but I think the same would apply to skim (but
not tested). The scripts look like this:
#! /bin/bash
export XMODIFIERS=@im=Ami
export LC_CTYPE=ko_KR.eucKR
export LANGUAGE=de
#export LANG=ko_KR.eucKR
ami &
oowriter
Then using <Shift>-<Space> I can switch between korean and german input.
In OO/kmail you also have to specify a font which supports the korean
input and/or specify the encoding.
I hope this helps for you too

Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 16, 2006 14:57 UTC (Thu) by jordi (guest, #14325) [Link]

Incidentally, a few Ubuntu people are gathering in London to work on this and other issues:
http://lwn.net/Articles/175719/
If you have the time, we really welcome your input on #ubuntu-l10n.

Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 12, 2006 17:32 UTC (Sun) by richo123 (guest, #24309) [Link]

I don't care when it is released. I am running a dual boot dapper/breezy and when I think the secondary dapper install is up to the job and sufficiently stable I will switch my primary partition. The dapper install is stable enough now that daily apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade generally is safe and keeps things close to the clean install.

Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 12, 2006 22:37 UTC (Sun) by proski (guest, #104) [Link]

My guess is that Fedora, Ubuntu and Linux kernel delays are all caused by Coverity reports. Even though there are false positives there, there may be real bugs with security implications, and bad guys are looking for such cases now. Nobody wants to release software with known unpatched security holes.

Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 13, 2006 1:39 UTC (Mon) by jcm (subscriber, #18262) [Link] (2 responses)

They probably want to avoid bugs like the following from sticking around for 5 years: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/shadow/+bug/...

Jon.

Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 13, 2006 22:30 UTC (Mon) by daniels (subscriber, #16193) [Link] (1 responses)

Except for the bit where it explicitly says dapper wasn't vulnerable, as wasn't hoary, or warty ...

Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 13, 2006 22:46 UTC (Mon) by jcm (subscriber, #18262) [Link]

Except for the bit where I used the word "like" to indicate bugs *like* the one I referenced. Big annoying bugs that stick around for 5 years are not something you would want to have. I was saying that it's worth getting it right the first time.

Jon.

Ubuntu "Dapper" delay proposed

Posted Mar 13, 2006 10:32 UTC (Mon) by pointwood (guest, #2814) [Link]

Quite okay with me. I will gladly wait a few weeks extra to get a more stable and polished release.


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