Or maybe just stop?!? [LWN.net]

Or maybe just stop?!?

Posted Feb 21, 2026 17:12 UTC (Sat) by intelfx (subscriber, #130118)
In reply to: Or maybe just stop?!? by marcH
Parent article: Open-source Discord alternatives

> But as Josh just wrote, that "loss" is a feature, not a bug. Often enough you do want "instant" messaging to be ephemeral - by design. Different types of tools for different use cases.

Except that the "use case" is often not known in advance. You can't know whether the conversation you are going to have will constitute an exchange of knowledge worth preserving for future reference.

> Would you want all your _oral_ conversations to be systematically recorded and archived? Some yes, most not.

Perhaps don't use public project spaces for those conversations that you wouldn't want to be systematically recorded and archived?

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Or maybe just stop?!?

Posted Feb 21, 2026 17:31 UTC (Sat) by marcH (subscriber, #57642) [Link] (2 responses)

> Except that the "use case" is often not known in advance. You can't know whether the conversation you are going to have will constitute an exchange of knowledge worth preserving for future reference.

Yes: communication is not an exact science. Never has been. Must still keep trying!

> Perhaps don't use public project spaces for those conversations that you wouldn't want to be systematically recorded and archived?

This is not really an issue. When in a public space, most people nowadays are aware there is a good chance they can be recorded and archived for some unknown amount of time, possibly infinite.

The real issue raised by Cyberax was the other way round: users wrongly expecting public discussions to be recorded and available. This is the only issue I was referring to.

> > Would you want all your _oral_ conversations to be systematically recorded and archived? Some yes, most not.

What I meant here: ephemeral discussions are a common and valid use case, so it's not a surprise that tools for ephemeral discussions exist. It's not just about privacy, it's about being ephemeral by design.

Or maybe just stop?!?

Posted Feb 21, 2026 17:37 UTC (Sat) by intelfx (subscriber, #130118) [Link] (1 responses)

> Yes: communication is not an exact science. Never has been. Must still keep trying!

This is inconsequential. I demonstrated a specific reason why "use right tools for right use-cases" is not a solution to the problem Cyberax raised.

> The real issue raised by Cyberax was the other way round: users wrongly expecting public discussions to be recorded and available. This is the only issue I was referring to.

Well, what *I* meant was that it is not a wrong expectation. It is a correct expectation.

Or maybe just stop?!?

Posted Feb 21, 2026 17:53 UTC (Sat) by marcH (subscriber, #57642) [Link]

> I demonstrated a specific reason why "use right tools for right use-cases" is not a solution to the problem Cyberax raised.

There is no other solution and it solves the issue the majority of the time. It will never be 100% of the time because communication is not an exact science.

> > users wrongly expecting public discussions to be recorded and available.

> Well, what *I* meant ...

I assumed you were answering the bit you quoted.

> ... was that it is not a wrong expectation. It is a correct expectation.

Back to reality, the need for ephemeral discussions will always exist and "incorrect" tools for them will too. I'm sorry but the world will never get rid of those "incorrect", ephemeral tools just because you don't like them. At best you can dictate and inconvenience the projects you have a strong influence on. Merely inconvenience because people will find and use other ephemeral channels.

Here's a typical example:
- I couldn't figure how to do X, does anyone know?
- Did you check page Y?
- Ha! No I missed Y, thanks. How come it's not linked from Z that I did fiund?
- Good idea: Z should link to Y. Can you send a pull request?
- Will do! Thanks again.

Projects generally do not want to record and archive these, hence direct them to ephemeral tools. Yes, there will always be collateral damage where some things that should be archived, won't. I'm afraid we can only try to mitigate that collateral damage.