The Linux Gazette forks

[Posted November 2, 2003 by corbet]

From:		jimd-AT-starshine.org
To:		lwn-AT-lwn.net
Subject:		Linux Gazette, Reborn
Date:		Sat, 1 Nov 2003 14:50:01 +0000
Cc:		lgang-AT-linuxnj.com


 Issue #96 is now available at: http://linuxgazette.net/issue96/index.html

 This issue marks a change in hosting provisions. The Linux Gazette
 is no longer associated with SSC (publishers of the Linux Journal).
 The staff (all volunteers) of the Linux Gazette reached a consensus to
 make new arrangements and we are all now at the linuxgazette.net site.

 For details about these changes please read Ben Okopnik's lead
 editorial: http://linuxgazette.net/issue96/reborn.html

 ... and for an historical perspective Rick Moen has but together a
 retrospective: http://linuxgazette.net/issue96/moen.html

 I, Jim Dennis, will be continuing on in my role as curmudgeon coach
 to "The Answer Gang" while Mike Orr and Heather Stern continue to do
 most of the work.

 One note which might cause some confusion:  SSC Inc. has implemented
 a CMS-driven (content management system) which they are still calling
 The Linux Gazette (http://www.linuxgazette.COM/ ).  We consider this
 to be a fork in the project.
 
 While we appreciate SSC's support over the last several years, and
 we wish them well in their endeavors; we felt that the CMS-based approach
 detracted from Linux Gazette's fundamental nature as an online periodical
 which could continue to be easily mirrored, packaged, translated, indexed,
 and incorporated into the Linux Documentation Project (LDP) as it has
 been since before its sponsorship by SSC.

 Also please note that Heather Stern and I (Jim Dennis) have no
 editorial control over the CMS-driven site, despite the appearance of
 our names under the "Staff" heading at the bottom of linuxgazette.COM's
 index page.  While we're honored for the recognition of our past
 efforts, we hope this won't cause any confusion for the readership of
 these two respective sites.

-- 
Jim Dennis,		                          The Linux Gazette "Answer Gang"
Linux Gazette is Published under the OPL     http://www.linuxgazette.net

This is quite disturbing, IMO

Posted Nov 2, 2003 17:36 UTC (Sun) by TheOneKEA (guest, #615) [Link]

What I find the most frightening was that the SSC was censoring content not only without informing the staff, but also censoring previously published content, without the staff's consent. Why have they chosen to do this? I like the text format of the Gazette; if I want a CMS, I can go to Slashdot!

Thank God for the OPL, and the Debian LG mirror packages.

The Linux Gazette forks

Posted Nov 2, 2003 22:04 UTC (Sun) by wolfrider (guest, #3105) [Link]

--Thanks for all your hard work LG and LWN; updated my link.

Misleading headline

Posted Nov 3, 2003 14:21 UTC (Mon) by dave (guest, #7) [Link] (3 responses)

The headline of this story is misleading, as Linux Gazette has not really forked. The editors (and owners) of LG have simply moved to another hosting location.

Now, how SSC responds, will be another matter. It looks to me like the LG folks just want to continue doing what they have been doing, but SSC wants to take this in the wrong direction. SSC could be hard-nosed with the domain and cause a fork, but I just can't see it happening. Hopefully they will give the linuxgazette.com domain to the editors and that'll be that. If they don't do that, then maybe we'll have a fork.

Dave

Misleading headline

Posted Nov 3, 2003 14:56 UTC (Mon) by drathos (guest, #6454) [Link] (1 responses)

Did you bother to read the whole story?

One note which might cause some confusion: SSC Inc. has implemented a CMS-driven (content management system) which they are still calling The Linux Gazette (http://www.linuxgazette.COM/ ). We consider this to be a fork in the project.

They say right in the announcement that not only does SSC plan on keeping the .com domain, but they are creating a fork.

Misleading headline

Posted Nov 4, 2003 2:29 UTC (Tue) by dave (guest, #7) [Link]

My mistake. Next time I'll ensure I have had my coffee before posting. Best wishes to you guys at LG.

Misleading headline

Posted Nov 3, 2003 15:17 UTC (Mon) by AnswerGuy (guest, #1256) [Link]

I don't believe the headline was misleading. We (at the LinuxGazette.NET) team are treating it as a fork because they are continuing to control part of the traditional LG namespace (the .com domain) and run some other sort of content on it.

We also would like to see the linuxgazette.com domain ceded to us and would be absolutely delighted to provide prominent links back to SSC's own domains. We generally feel that the CMS-driven site is not a "gazette" and that it should be given a name that more accurately reflects its nature and mission. (We won't presume to suggest any such names, either). :)

Ultimately the readership will choose. A large part of our readership is indirect (through the many mirror sites, including the translated versions, Debian packages, Palm PDB forms, etc). Because our old site no longer provides content which is amenable to these forms of distribution we want everyone to know where the traditional LG content can be found.

None of us wants this to be another "open source group airs its laundry" bickerfest. We're happy to link back to SSC's tine in the fork and would appreciate if they'd do our (mutual) readership the same courtesy.

Readers who wish to express their opinions are encouraged to be polite and to copy both of our sites: gazette@linuxgazette.NET (the new site for the old team) and (hunts at the old SSC site carrying the new CMS stuff) ... well I guess you'll have to post any feedback to them through their CMS engine at: http://www.linuxgazette.com/forum/20,

JimD

The Linux Gazette forks

Posted Nov 4, 2003 15:03 UTC (Tue) by ekj (guest, #1524) [Link] (1 responses)

Fair enough, except http://linuxgazette.net/ gives connection refused.

The Linux Gazette forks

Posted Nov 4, 2003 19:32 UTC (Tue) by Frodo (guest, #16508) [Link]

That seems to have been a temporary problem - it is up again now.

SSC is censoring its forums; claiming trademark

Posted Nov 6, 2003 0:19 UTC (Thu) by rickmoen (subscriber, #6943) [Link]

SSC just now summarily deleted the approx. 1/2 to 1/3 of all posts to its Web forum that in any way mentioned the departure of Linux Gazette to http://linuxgazette.net/. There is no explanation of this in the forum proper, but SSC publisher Phil Hughes has addressed it his Publisher's Corner weblog. In it, he says SSC has been "advised" (impliedly, by legal counsel) to delete all posts that mention the editors' new site, as trespassing against what he calls "our Linux Gazette trademark".

As part of the discussion process that went into the staff's (unanimous) decision to leave, the editors attempted due diligence to prevent transgressing anyone's copyrights and trademarks. We found that no trademarks for Linux Gazette had ever been registered — and moreover that, by law, trademark coverage is available only for marks used on an ongoing basis for branding purposes on products sold in commerce. LG has always been explictly non-commercial. Remember, too, that the Gazette had already established its name and identity on its own, long before accepting SSC's kind offer of help in 1996.

So I am mystified about the trademark claim, and cannot help thinking it inherently bogus. At the minimum, it will take a great deal of explaining. Also, isn't he implicitly claiming ownership of our volunteer Linux-community magazine's name as a commercial property? Is this going to become the new pattern for SSC's approach to volunteer-run, non-commercial Linux community projects? Offer to help them out, and then convert them against the volunteers' wishes to commercial corporate assets?

I hope Mr. Hughes's advisors can convince him that the above honestly is not the precedent he wants for his company's relations with the volunteer Linux community, and will help him turn back from this course of action, before the damage can no longer be repaired. We've been trying to take the high road, and hope everyone else will, too.

Last, my thanks to LWN for offering this feedback forum, and for carrying the story.

Censorship

Posted Nov 7, 2003 7:54 UTC (Fri) by alrac (guest, #16623) [Link]

Anyone else notice how the editorial http://linuxgazette.net/issue96/reborn.html has drastically changed since it was first published? Gone are the remarks about SSC hijacking LG articles, and stripping bylines and staff credits. Gone are the remarks about SSC making these major changes without talking to LG staff.

And SSC is using the Linux Gazette name and motto- "Making linux a little more fun"

I think this is a bad situation, and SSC looks like the bad guys.