Time for another Europatent push [LWN.net]

Time for another Europatent push

Posted Oct 20, 2003 23:08 UTC (Mon) by coriordan (guest, #7544) [Link]

Unfortunately it's not like that.

We won the big battle, the one where all MEPs get to vote. Next comes the Coucil, where one representative from each country votes. Many people are saying that most countries default to a member of their patent offices for an opinion. Basically the patent offices will be asked "would you like power over more stuff?"

And they'll say, "this is our job, we are the experts here, we say patentability should be extended to cover software".

Why bother, I ask?

Posted Oct 20, 2003 23:19 UTC (Mon) by stuart (subscriber, #623) [Link]

I suppose what strikes me is:

The EU as a body is so corrupt and unaccountable that there is a nuclear waste train's worth of inevitability about silly patents. So despite not wanting them, I become so demoralised that I cannot be bothered to help fight them.

I don't know how other Europeans (yurgh I hate that -- I am British not European) feel but I am just so disenchanted with our politicians and undemocratic (let's not pretend) EU commission et al that I am instead waiting for the big revolt that will one day come where people across Europe say enough is enough: The status quo is silly and I am fed up with my rights to do what I want being revoked. People will stick two fingers up at the European government (as it probably will be by then) and hopefully return to a more saner plane of equilibrium.

...Time will tell.

Stu.

Why bother, I ask?

Posted Oct 21, 2003 4:41 UTC (Tue) by coriordan (guest, #7544) [Link]

I don't share all of your pessimism about the current state, or your optimism about a revolt.

Look at America. They get all sorts of stupid laws rammed down their throats, but you don't see them revolting. BigBusiness is smart. When they want to shut down napster, they don't stick a fat cat on the TV, they get Metallica to say it for them.

One of the big problems with broadening the patent system is that it's very hard to undo. Patents are private property, once handed out they are out of the control of governments.

I've gotten a lot of great responses from MEPs I've talked to. I really believe most of them are doing their best. There are a few Arlene McCarthys in there too, but their mostly good. Ireland has 15 MEPs. 4 didn't turn up for the vote, but the other 11 voted exactly as we asked them to (with detailed explanatory letters).

We weren't expecting such a complete victory at the plenary stage, maybe we'll be pleasently surprised by what happens at the Council stage too. Since we have educated our MEPs, the Council will have to put up a good case to go against their decision.

I reckon it's worth at least one letter.

Why bother, I ask?

Posted Oct 23, 2003 11:33 UTC (Thu) by zmower (subscriber, #3005) [Link]

Look at America. They get all sorts of stupid laws rammed down their throats, but you don't see them revolting. BigBusiness is smart. When they want to shut down napster, they don't stick a fat cat on the TV, they get Metallica to say it for them.

I think all this did was make fans realise that Metallica have totally sold out. My final CD purchase of theirs was ...And Justice For All (and no, I won't be P2Ping their stuff or attending their concerts; I'm definitely an ex-fan).

Given the recent RIAA actions, some sort of civil disobedience is in order. Even a small personal decision to not buy any RIAA CDs would be a start. I'll take that pledge.

I reckon it's worth at least one letter.

Mine went last Sunday. I've also asked my employers what their thoughts are on the current legislation given that it's bound to drive up costs. As the UK government is our major customer, I've also asked them if they've expressed these views to their customers. You never know...

Why bother, I ask?

Posted Oct 21, 2003 7:13 UTC (Tue) by bryn (guest, #1482) [Link]

I think you're in for a long wait for a revolution. Your time might be better spent pressing the case against software patents to your MEP.

What do you have against the EU compared to UK government?
The EU may not be as democratic as it should, but mainly because some countries (the UK in particular) continue to hold veto over motions.

Why bother, I ask?

Posted Oct 23, 2003 23:06 UTC (Thu) by Cato (subscriber, #7643) [Link]

At present it's best for EU citizens to lobby their national MPs, e.g. Members of Parliament in the UK. I wrote a letter to my MP this week through the excellent http://www.faxyourmp.com/ - UK only but very easy to use.

Why bother, I ask?

Posted Oct 21, 2003 13:34 UTC (Tue) by wookey (subscriber, #5501) [Link]

The EU certainly has its problems as a beaurocracy, but on this particular issue it's doing a much better job of being democratic than the UK govt has so far. The UK govt has been a big supporter of software patents. If you believe that our government should be representing our views then you need to write to your MP on this issue.

If it is left to the UK government then US-style software patents are very likely to become a reality in the UK. The issue has be taken out of the hands of patent professionals, and the views of sensible developers such as ourselves taken into account.

Why bother, I ask?

Posted Oct 22, 2003 11:33 UTC (Wed) by Wol (guest, #4433) [Link]

So you're British, not European, eh.

Well, Britain is part of Europe, so you're both. Actually, I strongly suspect you feel ENGLISH, not British, because the feelings you express are felt almost entirely by those Brits who don't seem to realise the Welsh, Scots or Irish even exist.

I'd describe myself as a mix of English, Scottish and German. As such, I *DO* feel decidedly European, although I do despair at their elevation of ideology over practicality - in that respect I am truly English alone :-)

Cheers,
Wol

Time for another Europatent push

Posted Oct 21, 2003 7:00 UTC (Tue) by libra (guest, #2515) [Link]

I hope you are wrong when saying that most countries will default to a member of patent office for an opinion.
I hope that most countries will recognize that not only would that give a biased an uncontrolled by them result, but also that the case is so important that only research/science/industrie ministers shall speak on that topic and finally have to assume the decision during the Council.
The decision is too much political to be handed lightly, even when other big topics like European Constitutions, Security and Ecocomy attract the attention elsewhere.

Council of Ministers

Posted Oct 21, 2003 12:20 UTC (Tue) by j_heald (guest, #15398) [Link]

However, the free software community has educated the europarlement about the dangers, and the europarlement has clearly spoken. I expect they won't change their mind soon. It looks pretty hard now that the swpat lobby can fullfill all their wishes.

The EU Council of Ministers pretty much has *contempt* for the Parliament. The ministers see it as *their* job to govern, as representatives of national governments -- with the Parliament just a basically unnecessary irrelevant source of hot air.

What we 'won' was a first reading debate in the Parliament. The debate which comes next is a second reading debate, based on whatever text comes out of the ministers' meeting on November 10th, with different voting rules that make it far harder for MEPs to pass amendments.

As the LWN summary says: "The European Parliament's rules for second reading make it very difficult for MEPs to fix a bad text from the Council".

That is why we to do everything we can *now* to get national MPs and national governments to fix the Council text -- before it is too late.