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GNU sed 4.2.2 released; maintainer resignsGNU sed 4.2.2 released; maintainer resignsPosted Dec 28, 2012 12:34 UTC (Fri) by khim (subscriber, #9252)In reply to: GNU sed 4.2.2 released; maintainer resigns by dlang Parent article: GNU sed 4.2.2 released; maintainer resigns
how about the widespread use of Windows? Thanks for the reminder. In Enterprise Programming, the prior fad was C++. Absolutely not. The prior fad was called Visual Basic (by some estimates half of the “programmers” in circa 2000 were Visual Basic programmers. And before that it was xBase (dBase, Clipper, etc). The fact that enterprise programming graduated to some [relatively] modern and sane language is kind of astonishing, but it just shows that “enterprise programmers” are improving. “Enterprise programming” is not about good code. It's as in the following dialogue: Chode: Ok, they might have been slightly used. Chode talks about saving big on the “dutritium rods” and “enterprise programming” is about saving big on the software engineers but the principle stays: it's about something barely functioning but “even cheaper then “cheap, cheap, cheap””. Enterprise programming do advance over time: remember that it started with “ADD b TO c GIVING a” because “a = b + c” was considered too cumbersome for these “cheap, cheap, cheap” programmers. If you'll view evolution of “enterprise programming” from this POV then Java is indeed the pinnacle of said evolution: you can finally easily construct anything you want in the “enterprise language” (you don't need these expensive C++ programmers to create “components” now! yay!) and language even tries to detect and report most problems—what's not to like? As usual, the fact that some language is widely used by “enterprise programmers” probably means that is's too inefficient to use for the projects where people actually know what they are doing, but, gasp, it's finally language which you can actually use to create [somewhat] efficient programs! Finally, after all these years!
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GNU sed 4.2.2 released; maintainer resigns Posted Dec 28, 2012 21:22 UTC (Fri) by Cyberax (✭ supporter ✭, #52523) [Link]
Well, Java is exactly "ADD 1 TO COBOL GIVING COBOL". The same in Java is: java.setValue(java.getValue()+1).
GNU sed 4.2.2 released; maintainer resigns Posted Dec 29, 2012 1:15 UTC (Sat) by hummassa (subscriber, #307) [Link]
C++
That's why I don't understand how can people can find it ugly. :-D
GNU sed 4.2.2 released; maintainer resigns Posted Dec 29, 2012 1:39 UTC (Sat) by dlang (✭ supporter ✭, #313) [Link]
This is a good writeup.
Along similar lines, many of these same managers see DevOps as a way to eliminate those expensive *nix admins (I've heard many people use this as an excuse for using Windows, even in non-profit orgs with *nix people volunteering)
and many such managers are embracing the "cloud" because it again lets them eliminate expensive admins, and in addition the expensive facilities people
One world Posted Dec 29, 2012 11:51 UTC (Sat) by man_ls (subscriber, #15091) [Link] I cannot possibly see how replacing the expensive sysadmin with a very expensive developer is a good move. Keep in mind that your average coding monkey will not know a thing about DevOps.I see value in having a homogeneous set of workers which can both work on development and administration; in fact that is how I prefer to work. Having two worlds where one side hurls undeployable code to the poor sysadmin side creates unnecessary barriers; while deploying your own code is good, and also makes sure that deployment is simple enough. Same goes for cloud deployments. Commercial cloud services are really expensive compared with buying and maintaining your own servers, even when you factor sysadmin salaries. What they give is flexibility, and the ability to play around without waiting for decades to get hardware. Sysadmin people, it's time to sharpen your development skills. And viceversa. We are one world once again.
One world Posted Dec 29, 2012 17:33 UTC (Sat) by dlang (✭ supporter ✭, #313) [Link]
> I cannot possibly see how replacing the expensive sysadmin with a very expensive developer is a good move. Keep in mind that your average coding monkey will not know a thing about DevOps.
Ahh, you just don't "get it", developers actually produce something, as a result, their expense can be justified.
But Sysadmins are just overhead, eliminating pure overhead is good, and DevOps promises to make things easier and faster by letting the developers do whatever they want. (this is not what DevOps is supposed to be, but this is what managers hear it to be)
> Having two worlds where one side hurls undeployable code to the poor sysadmin side creates unnecessary barriers
I agree with this, but I don't agree that every developer and sysadmin should be equally skilled in both specialities. They need to understand enough of the other's tasks to respect them, and to appriciate the expertise that they bring to the table.
GNU sed 4.2.2 released; maintainer resigns Posted Dec 29, 2012 11:45 UTC (Sat) by marcH (subscriber, #57642) [Link]
> you can finally easily construct anything you want in the “enterprise language” (you don't need these expensive C++ programmers to create “components” now! yay!) and language even tries to detect and report most problems—what's not to like?
Yes. Massively reducing the amount of rope the programming masses used to be given to hang themselves with: definitely a major progress for the human kind. Really don't care if this requires double or triple more hardware to run since that's much cheaper than education.
As the experienced C++ developer you seem to present yourself as you should be happy because I think a rising tide lift all boats - even the C++ boat. I mean, even while C++ (or any other expert language) is losing market *share* there will still be increased demand for them if the overall market is growing fast.
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