Dricot: A freasy future for GNOME [LWN.net]

Dricot: A freasy future for GNOME

Posted Aug 10, 2012 22:59 UTC (Fri) by khim (subscriber, #9252)
In reply to: Dricot: A freasy future for GNOME by thebluesgnr
Parent article: Dricot: A freasy future for GNOME

By that line of thinking, GNOME wouldn't even exist. Wasn't it too late to create a free software desktop after Windows 98 had already "won"?

No, because it was not created for the desktop which Windows 98 won. That desktop was (and still is) untouchable for the likes of GNOME! Instead GNOME (and KDE) filled the void left by demise of the commercial UNIX. FreeBSD and Linux filled the void on "classic, text-based server" since GNU tools were already in wide use when said demise happened, but OPEN LOOK (later OpenWindows), CDE and others were not available - they were proprietary and their creators only freed them years later, when GNOME far surpassed them. Thus GNOME had small yet quite desperate group of potential users who adopted and supported it. From the beginning to now this group is the same. But it's shrinking now because people have a nice alternative: MacOS. Sure, they are not the target group, but if you want "Unix with nice GUI" then MacOS is quite usable replacement novadays.

This is where Lionel loses the track: some people care about freedom, but most people don't. At least they don't care enough to drop convenience of Android and/or iOS. Think about it: most Linux users use it not because it's free but because it's cheap (I'm talking about server and emdebbed here, obviously, not about desktop: on desktop, indeed, most users prefer Linux because it's free… and we all know how many of these are out there — one or two users out of hundred care about freedom, tops). If you want to attract users to GNOME-based tablet then you either need to offer something for cheap (but Android has this base covered) or you need something unique (and no, freedom is not a good selling point as shown above). Easiness of install??? Pushlease: no matter how easy you'll make it it'll be harder then pre-install anyway. We are comparing zero efforts here with non-zero efforts! Thus yes, easiness of installation is cool, but this only lowers the entry bar, you still need some attraction to get users. Because without users eventually your platform will lose developers, too, then it'll become a zombie.

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Dricot: A freasy future for GNOME

Posted Aug 12, 2012 2:22 UTC (Sun) by elanthis (guest, #6227) [Link]

> Think about it: most Linux users use it not because it's free but because it's cheap (I'm talking about server and emdebbed here, obviously, not about desktop: on desktop, indeed, most users prefer Linux because it's free

I'd argue that most Linux desktops users are those looking to tinker and play around. Look at the install base of proprietary drivers, the excitement over Steam, and the constant demand for more ISVs to support Linux. I don't see Freedom being the most valued attribute of Linux on the desktop.

Personally, the vast majority of folks I get asking me about Linux outside of the server are programmery types looking for cool toys to tinker with. Freedom is not a concept that they have yet grasped, most of them care just as little as anyone else, and cheapness is hardly an issue for them. Obviously my anecdotal evidence here is biased, since I'm surrounded by programmery types in an industry that is very proprietary in nature, so take that as you will.

The plural of anecdote

Posted Aug 12, 2012 17:12 UTC (Sun) by Wol (guest, #4433) [Link]

IS data.

Okay, anecdotes are often a biased sample, but as another poster said - "everyone I know" ...

When you get stuff like that, you *need* to find the explanation if you want to understand. I suspect that people who object to anecdotes are actually indulging in the very UNscientific pursuit of collecting only the evidence that confirms their prejudice, not the scientific pursuit of evidence whether or not it supports them. Indeed, true science is the pursuit of evidence that does NOT support you.

If you can't find any, then you can conclude you are probably right :-)

Cheers,
Wol

Dricot: A freasy future for GNOME

Posted Aug 13, 2012 8:44 UTC (Mon) by Pawlerson (guest, #74136) [Link]

I'd argue that most Linux desktops users are those looking to tinker and play around. Look at the install base of proprietary drivers, the excitement over Steam, and the constant demand for more ISVs to support Linux. I don't see Freedom being the most valued attribute of Linux on the desktop.

From my observations freedom doesn't matter much for most of the Linux users, but it's the most important to Linux itself. What most users want is software. That's why Windows is so popular. Its users don't care if their toy OS has vulnerabilities that come from DOS or that GUI operates in the kernel space. Bring software to Linux and Windows will loose an only advantage.