O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
While we're still trying to understand exactly what might have happened at Oscon or other O'Reilly conferences in the past, it's become clear that this is a real, long-standing issue in the technical community. And we do know this: we don't condone harassment or offensive behavior, at our conferences or anywhere. It's counter to our company values. More importantly, it's counter to our values as human beings."
Posted Jul 25, 2011 21:29 UTC (Mon)
by kragilkragil2 (guest, #76172)
[Link] (12 responses)
Posted Jul 25, 2011 22:21 UTC (Mon)
by ballombe (subscriber, #9523)
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Posted Jul 26, 2011 10:26 UTC (Tue)
by fb (guest, #53265)
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Posted Jul 25, 2011 22:34 UTC (Mon)
by flewellyn (subscriber, #5047)
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Posted Jul 26, 2011 16:57 UTC (Tue)
by kragilkragil2 (guest, #76172)
[Link] (2 responses)
Posted Jul 30, 2011 17:33 UTC (Sat)
by sbergman27 (guest, #10767)
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Male/Female, Gay/Nongay, Good Looking/Not, Old/Young...
We should probably have more identifying info printed on our name tags. And be sequestered in separated halls, with only virtual access to members of other groups.
But seriously, we had a really slimy sales guy working for the company I used to work for. We sent him to a sales conference and got a call from a conference attendee who was literally in tears after an encounter with him. Somehow, he managed to keep his job. I always thought somewhat less of our company owner after that. I suppose thought he was doing the right thing. I'll give him credit for that. But talk about bad calls. The guy he decided to spare was a slime-ball. But he was good at sales.
Posted Aug 3, 2011 15:10 UTC (Wed)
by jtc (guest, #6246)
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How is what you appear to be claiming compatible with this sentence from the O'Reilly quote: "And we do know this: we don't condone harassment or offensive behavior, at our conferences or anywhere."
How does 'anywhere' not cover other venues?
Posted Jul 25, 2011 22:47 UTC (Mon)
by antifuchs (subscriber, #34569)
[Link] (5 responses)
Way to ruin good news, LWN. )-:
Posted Jul 25, 2011 22:57 UTC (Mon)
by corbet (editor, #1)
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Posted Jul 25, 2011 23:28 UTC (Mon)
by antifuchs (subscriber, #34569)
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Posted Jul 26, 2011 9:21 UTC (Tue)
by endecotp (guest, #36428)
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And people frequently don't realise that. Consider adding quotation marks.
Posted Jul 26, 2011 9:49 UTC (Tue)
by roblucid (guest, #48964)
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Posted Jul 27, 2011 16:57 UTC (Wed)
by landley (guest, #6789)
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(Well, yellow journalism is alive and well in the US. Under attack in the UK.)
Posted Jul 26, 2011 2:38 UTC (Tue)
by proski (subscriber, #104)
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Posted Jul 26, 2011 2:45 UTC (Tue)
by corbet (editor, #1)
[Link] (22 responses)
Are you worried about terrorists at events? Unlike the sort of behavior addressed by the action in the parent article, acts of terrorism at conferences haven't been much of a problem. Certain vendor keynotes come close, I must admit, but I think they fall short of the bar.
Posted Jul 26, 2011 5:30 UTC (Tue)
by karthik_s1 (guest, #60525)
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Posted Jul 26, 2011 9:37 UTC (Tue)
by niner (subscriber, #26151)
[Link] (19 responses)
It's the same as back then when I couldn't understand why we would put up rules against bringing forbidden drugs to our LAN parties. Why forbid something that's already forbidden? Just makes no sense to me.
Posted Jul 26, 2011 10:07 UTC (Tue)
by ekj (guest, #1524)
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Having pot is illegal most places, it doesn't -nessecarily- follow from that that people will generally toss you out from their property if you're found to be having any. Thus a policy that "anyone caught using illegal drugs will be ejected" can make sense, despite the fact that the drugs would be illegal even without the rule.
Furthermore, many places have rules that are significantly more restrictive than the law is. In this specific case for example, they say that "sexual or racist comments or images in slides (...) is not appropriate", and that you may not be invited back if such is found. This is significantly more restrictive than the law is. There's no law against showing a slide with (say!) some perl-code and a bikini-clad woman.
Posted Jul 26, 2011 10:11 UTC (Tue)
by fb (guest, #53265)
[Link] (3 responses)
A little anecdote for you: When I taught university classes during my phd, I found that spelling out what I considered to be plagiarism and making it clear that it would not be tolerated lead to zero "copied" assignments being delivered. If you care to ask, yes, the first time I taught classes I didn't bring plagiarism explicitly, and yes, I did get incidents.
I believe you are analyzing social behavior by using a form of logic that applies to computer science and math (at least that is a mistake I make often). People are not as rational as we often expect them to be. At least not all the time, and certainly not with respect to every aspect of their lives.
You need rules, and you need to make sure people are _aware_ of the rules. For frequently broken rules, you have to bring up the issue often.
Posted Jul 26, 2011 18:03 UTC (Tue)
by vaurora (guest, #38407)
[Link] (1 responses)
Posted Jul 27, 2011 12:42 UTC (Wed)
by fb (guest, #53265)
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Sure!
Posted Jul 26, 2011 18:08 UTC (Tue)
by niner (subscriber, #26151)
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Posted Jul 26, 2011 11:37 UTC (Tue)
by mjg59 (subscriber, #23239)
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Posted Jul 27, 2011 17:18 UTC (Wed)
by landley (guest, #6789)
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Because to enforce the law you have to go to the police. To enforce conference policy you don't have to leave the building.
"Management is not responsible for lost or stolen property" doesn't make theft legal, but "Management takes stolen property personally. has installed hidden cameras, and will nail perpetrators to the ceiling with railroad spikes" sets a different tone about guarding one's belongings. In both cases you can go to the police, but one's a bit more of a deterrent.
If theft was as common at Linux conferences as sexual harassment is, we wouldn't be arguing about the importance of the problem. "Oh, I'm a poor college student who lives locally, has no laptop, eats only ramen, and lives in a bad part of town so instinctively guards all belongings from pickpockets, and nobody's stolen anything from me" doesn't mean there isn't a problem. (Most Linux developers aren't targets for sexual anything, that's why it's called Unix.)
Rob
Posted Jul 29, 2011 5:14 UTC (Fri)
by clugstj (subscriber, #4020)
[Link] (11 responses)
Posted Jul 29, 2011 5:56 UTC (Fri)
by mjg59 (subscriber, #23239)
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Posted Jul 29, 2011 6:35 UTC (Fri)
by dark (guest, #8483)
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Posted Jul 29, 2011 15:25 UTC (Fri)
by mjg59 (subscriber, #23239)
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Posted Jul 29, 2011 15:46 UTC (Fri)
by dark (guest, #8483)
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Posted Jul 31, 2011 0:45 UTC (Sun)
by clugstj (subscriber, #4020)
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Posted Jul 31, 2011 0:54 UTC (Sun)
by dlang (guest, #313)
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that said, I attend a couple conferences a year and have never witnessed such behavior. (well, there was one presentation that included things that I found offensive that could have been taken as 'sexual harassment' by people who have that agenda, but I took it as bad taste on the part of the presenter, not targeted at any gender)
so while I have no doubt that it happens to some people somewhere, I don't think it's the major problem that people are making it out to be.
Posted Jul 31, 2011 4:19 UTC (Sun)
by sumanah (guest, #59891)
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Posted Jul 31, 2011 17:48 UTC (Sun)
by mjg59 (subscriber, #23239)
[Link] (3 responses)
First-person reports are rare. That's for a variety of reasons, but the most notable one is that when people *have* made posts about things that actually happened to them they end up with people calling them liars or sluts, told that there's no way that anyone would want to sexually harass someone as ugly as them, told that they should be flattered by the attention, told that since the police didn't get involved there's nothing to complain about and worse. They've already been through something traumatic, so why should they invite further abuse? The internet has spoken. Naming and shaming doesn't work, it just makes things worse.
So yes, most of what you'll find ends up being anonymised or poorly cited. That doesn't make it any less real or less severe.
Posted Jul 31, 2011 22:20 UTC (Sun)
by clugstj (subscriber, #4020)
[Link] (2 responses)
Without actual first-person reports, why would anyone believe it really happened? Good grief, are we really at the point where we believe anything that anyone blogs about? (and by the way, I'm not saying it doesn't happen, it may well be a deplorable situation, but with the low level of integrity in the new media [except LWN, of course], I think a certain degree of skepticism is reasonable.)
Posted Jul 31, 2011 22:56 UTC (Sun)
by mjg59 (subscriber, #23239)
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Posted Aug 1, 2011 15:26 UTC (Mon)
by duffy (guest, #31787)
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Do you really fully understand the severe consequences of coming out with the details of a sexual harassment incident?
Do you not understand how such incidents might be not only frightening to talk about as it may result various forms of 'retribution' for outing the incident, but also that the details of the incident in question might be highly embarrassing and traumatic to disclose in public?
If you weren't involved, I don't think the details of such an incident are any of your business.
Posted Jul 30, 2011 18:04 UTC (Sat)
by sbergman27 (guest, #10767)
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Posted Jul 29, 2011 11:53 UTC (Fri)
by tialaramex (subscriber, #21167)
[Link]
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
Just like farting, which is cool when you are with your bros, but not when you are with your parents in law.
And yeah, I didn't RTFA. Just hated the headline.
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
Perhaps they are spelling it out because this specific form of harassment "is a real, long-standing issue in the technical community"?
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
Um, excuse me? We almost always preserve the original headline when pointing to outside items like this. The headline was O'Reilly's, not ours. I don't believe we "ruined" anything...?
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
> pointing to outside items like this.
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
LWN is unusual in not spinning news overly, most news sources are prone to distortion, so highlighting quotes is good idea.
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
I hope they will forbid terrorism at technical conferences too. Terrorists should stick with non-technical events.
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
I suspect that most events would consider terrorist acts to be contrary to their codes of conduct already; probably no special action is required.
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
+1. ROTFL.
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
> conferences, when these rules are already coded into the law?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
How desperately unhelpful.
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
Simply replying "even cursory research would demonstrate that such examples abound" would have been ordinary unhelpfulness. You definitely went above and beyond by adding deceit and mockery and wasting the audience's time.
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
OK, now that sexual harassment has been deal with, how about terrorism?
O'Reilly: Sexual Harassment at Technical Conferences: A Big No-No
