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SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register)SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register)Posted Aug 5, 2003 23:03 UTC (Tue) by rknop (guest, #66)Parent article: SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Unless Red Hat's injunction is granted, with the IBM lawsuit so far off, SCO will make out like bandits. In the short term, companies committed to Linux and paranoid will pay up; even just a fraction, but it's all gangster money for SCO. In the long term, companies will move away from Linux. Linux will largely die. Eventually, Linux will be exonerated, and SCO will show to have been criminals but the damage will have been done. I think were I to meet Daryl McBride or Chris Sontag on the street, I would have a *very* hard time not slugging them very hard across the face. -Rob
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SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 5, 2003 23:05 UTC (Tue) by piman (subscriber, #8957) [Link] Is there actually any evidence that companies will pay up?How many companies using AIX switched over to Solaris/UnixWare when SCO revoked the AIX licensed?
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 0:24 UTC (Wed) by tjc (subscriber, #137) [Link] Is there actually any evidence that companies will pay up?It almost seems as if they don't want people to pay up, based on the cost of a license. I don't know how much Solaris runs these days, but $1399 seems high to me... We all know Linux is good, but I never realized that it was this good. :-)
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 0:42 UTC (Wed) by phil42 (guest, #5175) [Link] Good point. Stand up to the bitch-assed punks.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 2:04 UTC (Wed) by dbhost (guest, #3461) [Link] SCO has refused to show where they have any legitimate claim to any Intellectual property in Linux. They continue to distribute the Linux kernel with the GPL and all code as far as I have been able to ascertain intact and unmolested by removal of any SCO proprietary code. And now they want to charge me to use something they don't even own? Imagine the following call coming in to your local police station. (Redneck emphasis added to illustrate the absurdity of the situation).Dispatcher. "911 what is your emergency" (Dispatcher dimisses caller and gets on the radio to the patrol officer" Dispatcher "All units be on the lookout for a drunk bumpkin. Claims to have been robbed of nefarious property he refuses to identify, and wants former friend, Billy Joe dead. Looks like McBumpkin lost another competition." At best these guys are simpletons bumbling forward under the advice of a slimeball lawyer. I doubt it. I believe this is nothing short of Extortion and Racketeering.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 9:25 UTC (Wed) by djabsolut (guest, #12799) [Link] :-) exactlyWhat really puzzles me is why would any company, that uses Linux, be legally inclined to inform SCO on exactly how many Linux machines they use? SCO can do a grand total of squat until its IP infringement allegations are actually proven it a court of law (late 2005 at the earliest if we look only at the SCOvsIBM case). In other words, this licensing hoopla is yet another fine piece of FUD that will only catch the uninformed.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 18:13 UTC (Wed) by TheOneKEA (subscriber, #615) [Link] HAHAHA!!!!I think that illustrates the absurdity of SCO's actions quite accurately :) Somehow I believe that even if some people do pay just to keep SCO from falming them, they'll only pay for machines that people can identify remotely as being Linux-based. I'm sure the companies won't pay for machines that no one can see ;) Maybe NOW someone willwake up and nip SCO in the bud; I don't see how this could possibly not be considered extortion (IANAL).
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 20:32 UTC (Wed) by alexs (guest, #13637) [Link] *smile* nice contribution.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 5, 2003 23:18 UTC (Tue) by coriordan (guest, #7544) [Link] It's not this big a deal. Linux is a great kernel but it's no the only one.Robert Millan is currently porting Debian to the FreeBSD kernel. You'll have all the apps your used to, running with glibc, compiled with gcc, etc. Just a different kernel, most users would never notice. I'm not saying we ditch the Linux developers but we're partly to blame for this situation, we made Linux a Jesus nut for our GNU systems. If we stop being completely dependent on Linux, cases like this won't affect us. Would SCO have started this whole fiasco if our GNU systems were kernel-independant a year ago? Ciaran O'Riordan
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 5, 2003 23:25 UTC (Tue) by rknop (guest, #66) [Link] Kernel choice would be a great thing.On the other hand, the huge focus on Linux has given Linux a lot of device drivers. How good is the FreeBSD device driver support? For instance, are there DRI modules for the FreeBSD kernel that work with XFree86 4 and (say) Radeon cards? Also, though the GNU project may not like it, "Linux" is what has received the name recognition amongst the general world. A huge amount of ground will be lost if we have to generalize that and explain that we're generalizing it. -Rob
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 5, 2003 23:47 UTC (Tue) by coriordan (guest, #7544) [Link] > the huge focus on Linux has given Linux a lot of device driversIt's certainly an important point but the Linux and FreeBSD guys can at least look at eachothers code. (when the drivers are free software) > "Linux" is what has received the name recognition The importance of the term "GNU/Linux" is not an all or nothing issue, it's the more the merrier. If people don't hear about the GNU project, we are more likely to end up with 80% proprietary "Linux" OSs in ten years time. Back near square one. > A huge amount of ground will be lost if we have to generalize There's no point getting the message to a larger audience if we distort the message in the process. Do we want free software, studyable file formats, and usable protocols? or do we want people to run Linux-based OSs? How hard it is to get the message across doesn't mean we should change the message. Ciaran O'Riordan
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 0:11 UTC (Wed) by trutkin (guest, #3919) [Link] Well, no. The Linux guys can look at the BSD code, but the BSD guys can't look at the Linux code. License issues. Let's not start a flame war though.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 0:24 UTC (Wed) by coriordan (guest, #7544) [Link] > the BSD guys can't look at the Linux codeCopyright covers copying, not looking. From looking, comes knowledge and understanding, these are also beyond the scope of copyright.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 2:22 UTC (Wed) by Ross (subscriber, #4065) [Link] Looking at and copying are different things. But let's not start a flame war ;)
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 0:32 UTC (Wed) by DaveK (subscriber, #2531) [Link] > It's certainly an important point but the Linux and FreeBSD guys can at least look at> eachothers code. (when the drivers are free software) Better that the BSD guys don't look inside Linux. They might look at the code that SCO contests - especially if they don't know where it is, and at this point they become contaminated, and any work they undertake thereafter would become a potentially contestable 'derived work', and the cycle repeats. but IANAL.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 8, 2003 0:04 UTC (Fri) by daenzer (subscriber, #7050) [Link] > For instance, are there DRI modules for the FreeBSD kernel that work with> XFree86 4 and (say) Radeon cards? Yes, as well as with most other DRI supported cards. :) The DRM as shipped with XFree86 4.3 works on FreeBSD, the one in current DRI CVS on NetBSD as well, and I believe there are patches for OpenBSD. Most of the hardware-dependent code is shared between OSs.
BSD may be no safer Posted Aug 5, 2003 23:31 UTC (Tue) by corbet (editor, #1) [Link] Don't forget that SCO has cast its glance towards BSD more than once. If there were to be a mass exodus towards a BSD kernel, I don't doubt that SCO would discover something it "owns" there too...
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 0:11 UTC (Wed) by zonker (subscriber, #7867) [Link] You'll have all the apps your used to, running with glibc, compiled with gcc, etc. Just a different kernel, most users would never notice.If you're talking about users who are running uniprocessor systems, you're probably right. But a big part of commercial acceptance for Linux is its ability to run on SMP systems -- moving to the FreeBSD kernel isn't going to work for companies who are deploying Linux on SMP boxes. It's nice that the Debian folks are providing that alternative for users who want to run a BSD kernel, but it isn't going to solve the problem for a whole host of users and companies who have hardware that's not supported by FreeBSD... I've got two dual-CPU boxes and an old Dell PowerEdge with four Pentium Pro CPUs -- I'm not too anxious to install an OS that can't make use of SMP.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 0:31 UTC (Wed) by coriordan (guest, #7544) [Link] FreeBSD's kernel has SMP. It's in the stock kernel since 5.0.http://people.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/SMP.html I don't know how it compares to Linux, probably not as good but more users brings more development.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 0:47 UTC (Wed) by smoogen (subscriber, #97) [Link] And SCO wont be suing everyone for using BSD kernels and sowing the same fear uncertainty and doubt that SCO doesnt own the ideas behind FreeBSD... The rights that SCO 'owns' are to the hole AT&T OS.. that would be ls, rm, mv, etc etc etc.Running to another kernel will only delay the lawsuits for a week or two.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 7:56 UTC (Wed) by pointwood (subscriber, #2814) [Link] Quite interesting!Choice is good :)
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 5, 2003 23:39 UTC (Tue) by mmarq (guest, #2332) [Link] But to RED HAT to lose, SCO has to show were the infringing code is, and that code will be cleaned, perhaps in less than a week... so RED HAT by losing will actualy win.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 0:30 UTC (Wed) by dwalters (subscriber, #4207) [Link] True, Red Hat could fall on its sword, the infringing code identified and removed, and the world would move on. However, SCO might argue in court that the evidence should be "lawyers eyes only" due to trade secret issues, and if successful, the code would not be made public if SCO wins. Of course, Red Hat's argument is that since all Linux source code is public anyway, there are no secrets in it, so trade secret protections don't apply. This ought to be very compelling. Let's hope so, anyway. What really annoys me is the way SCO paints all of us Linux community folks as pirates who just want to get away with stealing their code. Based on all the fine, intelligent people I've met in our community, this couldn't be further from the truth. Almost all of us DO respect copyrights, and just want any copyright-infringing code, if it really is there, to be verifiably identified, removed, and rewritten in a clean room, so that GNU/Linux can be free of IP infringement issues. All this "We'll show you a little sample of infringing code if you sign an NDA, but you can't write any of it down, and we won't tell you exactly what the files are" nonsense is utterly contemptible, and I desperately hope that Red Hat win their summary judgements to put an end to it. Finally, if it's true that SCO programmers copied chunks of Linux into the Linux Kernel Personality layer of SCO's Unix product, and you're one of those programmers reading this, PLEASE do the honorable thing and come forward publicly about this; this is too big an issue, and too much damage can be done TO THE WHOLE FLOSS MOVEMENT by this SCO FUD engine for you to remain quiet about this.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 1:31 UTC (Wed) by mmarq (guest, #2332) [Link] Trade Secrets in a Open-Source kernel ?And if RED HAD lawyers are going to make a wonderfull job, they will bring up every kind of expert witness to validate every piece of SCO evidence. I belive those who signed that NDA were deceived all the time, because although they saw two pieces of identical code, they could not certify Sh?t.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 3:20 UTC (Wed) by freemars (subscriber, #4235) [Link] ...SCO might argue in court that the evidence should be "lawyers eyes only" due to trade secret issues... Perhaps Red Hat's lawyers could convince the judge to include all non-infringing code lines in some public document. By setting the price at $1399, SCO may have helped Red Hat decide how much to ask in damages.
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 17:07 UTC (Wed) by rknop (guest, #66) [Link] What really annoys me is the way SCO paints all of us Linux community folks as pirates who just want to get away with stealing their code. Agreed. Especially considering that SCO is trying to abscond with the huge amount of work that the Linux kernel community has done, and use it to justify lining their own pockets. Who are the real pirates here? Who are the ones committing wanton theft and abuse? Whose rights are being trampled upon? The fact that anybody at all in our society gives SCO absolutely any credence is an indication of how much perspective we have lost when it comes to the whole idea of "intellectual property rights". -Rob
SCO ready to clean out Linux users for $1399 per CPU (Register) Posted Aug 6, 2003 14:28 UTC (Wed) by hummassa (subscriber, #307) [Link] And this is exactly the reason why the injunction will probably be granted. But of course, you never know.
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