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Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM)
Free Software Magazine
reviews the Acer Linpus Linux Lite ultra portable laptop.
"It is due to launch here in the UK in early July with the GNU/Linux version with a price tag of £199. (Yes, surprise, surprise, theyre offering Windows XP too.) Given the specification (Intel atom N270 chip, 8.9 inch screen, webcam, 1024 x 600 resolution, 8GB SSD, three USB ports, VGA, and two SD card slots, two mini PCI slots (one for the WiFi and one for upcoming Wimax or HSDPA), Ethernet port, touchpad, 802.11b/g WiFi and a default 512MB of memory with a spare slot to add more) the Aspire One represents stonking good value for money."
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SSD write leveling? Posted Jul 4, 2008 2:20 UTC (Fri) by wtogami (subscriber, #32325) [Link] Anyone know if the SSD's in these ultraportables use write levelling to extend their lifetime?
SSD write leveling? Posted Jul 4, 2008 5:11 UTC (Fri) by Cato (subscriber, #7643) [Link] I don't think you can buy an SSD without an FTL (Flash Translation Layer) that does wear levelling. This article from a good site on SSDs talks about how in practice it's very unlikely an SSD will wear out: http://www.storagesearch.com/ssdmyths-endurance.html - given current flash write speeds and usage patterns it's more reliable than a hard disk.
SSD write leveling? Posted Jul 4, 2008 6:22 UTC (Fri) by wtogami (subscriber, #32325) [Link] I have been well aware of the SSD myths for a while now. Has it been explicitly stated that these ultraportables have write levelling? I wouldn't be surprised if some of the manufacturers don't in order to cut costs. Just being cautious here.
SSD write leveling? Posted Jul 4, 2008 10:02 UTC (Fri) by NRArnot (subscriber, #3033) [Link] Isn't it also the case that a flash block (almost) always fails during write? So if the SSD can't handle it with bad block relocation, the filesystem will mark the block as bad and put one's data elsewhere. Unless it's a really dumb filesystem that hammers on the one block that can't be relocated (like FAT floppy disks did!) It's far worse if a block is successfully written, and then goes bad later, as often happens to hard disks when they start degrading mechanically.
SSD write leveling? Posted Jul 4, 2008 14:19 UTC (Fri) by Cato (subscriber, #7643) [Link] It's worse than just losing a single block. A flash erase block can include many filesystem blocks as it's quite large - anything from 16 to 512 KB according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flash_memory#NAND_memories. And in some devices with poor FTLs, interrupting a single write can cause the whole device to fail - it's important that when the device comes back up, the FTL checks for partially written erase blocks and marks them as bad. Unfortunately FTLs appear to be mostly undocumented so you just have to rely on going for mid to high end flash products from a reputable vendor, assuming you care about reliability. Embedded flash products (e.g. CF drives) seem to have good reliability specs and may be a good option, at some extra cost.
SSD write leveling? Posted Jul 4, 2008 17:19 UTC (Fri) by jwb (guest, #15467) [Link] If they didn't have wear leveling, they would wear out within an hour. You probably wouldn't even get the OS installed before they wore out.
SSD write leveling? Posted Jul 4, 2008 13:52 UTC (Fri) by tzafrir (subscriber, #11501) [Link] I don't understand his math. First off, the limitation of number of writes is for a block. Not for a specific byte in a block. Thus the worst load for a flash is not a sequesial logger. It is an application that wries 1 then 0 and then 1 again to the same byte and does this to random bytes all over. He later writes an explanation as to why that data recorder "does the fastest damage". But I fail to folow the reasoning there.
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 4, 2008 2:53 UTC (Fri) by mattdm (subscriber, #18) [Link] Huh, apparently it comes pre-installed with a Fedora-derived distribution. Wonder if it's got questionable/non-free drivers added, or if it'd all just work with stock Fedora.
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 4, 2008 7:42 UTC (Fri) by luya (subscriber, #50741) [Link] Yes it does which is no different than Berry Linux, Fox Linux or Linx XP to name a few.
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 4, 2008 8:13 UTC (Fri) by rvfh (subscriber, #31018) [Link] The article said that you could use it with a clear conscience, which to me meant no proprietary drivers. Would you mind telling us which proprietary drivers are being used? And where you found the info? I was hopping it would be an all-Intel device, and thus would use only free drivers...
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 4, 2008 17:16 UTC (Fri) by luya (subscriber, #50741) [Link] Right about Lite Version. Media Center 2.0 uses codecs for DVD playback support.
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 4, 2008 11:09 UTC (Fri) by mattdm (subscriber, #18) [Link] "Yes it does add binary-only drivers", you mean? And, to be blunt, why should I care that this is no different from a list of minor distributions? I don't want to run a random minor distribution.
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 4, 2008 17:08 UTC (Fri) by luya (subscriber, #50741) [Link] Linpus Linux is very well-known in China and Taiwan. A simple visit to their website should provide you more details.
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 4, 2008 17:48 UTC (Fri) by proski (subscriber, #104) [Link] The site looks pathetic. "Legal" and "Privacy" links are imitations, FAQ is empty, search is not functional. The bug tracking system is nowhere to be seen. And most importantly, the site doesn't even mention security updates!
Atom benchmarks Vs Pentium 3? Posted Jul 4, 2008 9:41 UTC (Fri) by NigelK (guest, #42083) [Link] Out of interest, how do the Atom processors compare with Pentium 3 processors in benchmark tests? I'm thinking of switching out my ancient home webserver and fileserver for an Eee Box and a 500GB NAS, partially to improve performance, but mainly to save power usage - a Pentium 3 PC plus 4 IDE disks can't be that optimal when it comes to electricity consumption!
Atom benchmarks Vs Pentium 3? Posted Jul 23, 2008 5:01 UTC (Wed) by Eichenix (guest, #53044) [Link] Do you now how to integrate the NAS 500 into Linpus via a network. The "explorer" within the spire linpus does not support this linking to the LAN?!
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 4, 2008 9:59 UTC (Fri) by alonso (subscriber, #2828) [Link] Here in Italy it costs 299 euro.
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 4, 2008 13:30 UTC (Fri) by Duncan (guest, #6647) [Link] I'm planning to get one with the SSD, expand it with a SATA drive (it apparently has the SATA port ready, used with the 2.5" HDD version, but the SSD is hard-soldered), and install Gentoo from binary packages I've merged into a chroot onto my main system. I've wanted a decent freedomware based 120 gig-plus MP3 player for awhile. For the longest time, they basically weren't available. Then they were (160 gig ipod classic and etc), but only with proprietaryware firmware. Then the Eee genre came out and I thought it was perfect, as it would be be way MORE than an MP3 player, being an actual fully functional Linux install with small but standard keyboard and all, but of course the SSD was way to small and it had no direct SATA/PATA interface, and the 800 px wide screen was good as an MP3 player but somewhat crippled as a full Linux laptop display. Still, I was tempted to get it and hardware-hack it with say four 32-gig USB flash drives hard-wired into it. There's a lot of hardware-hacking info on the net for it, so it would have been relatively easy. But I wondered what that might do to the already limited (for an mp3 player) battery life. Chances are I could have it shut down the display when using it as an mp3 player only, but I wasn't sure. Then the bigger Eee came out, but it still didn't look to allow direct SATA expansion and was rather more expensive. I looked at the various competitors as they were announced as well, but couldn't find one that fit what I needed, with good specs and etc. The hardware on the MSI Wind looked decent, but they haven't been known for their Linux friendliness and I rejected them a few years ago when looking at a main machine upgrade because all their downloadables were MS exe format. Docs in (apparently) self-extracting exes, not PDF or the like. BIOS updates, self extracting exe, everything, executable. I wrote them at the time and told them exactly why they were being crossed off my list. (I ended up with a Tyan mobo; they had a Linux FAQ and support, multiple distro certified, even a preconfigured sensors.conf for use with lm_sensors! I've been VERY happy with them! =8^) While that particular MSI machine now ships with a Linux preinstalled option, I still don't trust them and barring some extremely good MSI/Linux reviews which I've yet to see, they are still off my list. Then the Acer Aspire One was announced, and coming about the same time was a bunch of associated PR about Acer planning to make Linux an option for their entire line, over time. This was a very positive sign, and the hardware was getting good reviews as well. One site even took it apart and listed what was upgradable (including that SATA detail I was particularly interested in) and what not. As for the SATA upgrade, now that they announced a shipping upgrade to 120 gig, I'm thinking about getting it and forgetting about the hacking. However, the SSD version still looks interesting, particularly if I couple it with a 120 gig SSD drive like the SuperTalent 120 GIG 2.5" SATA format SSD now available from newegg for <$600 (multi-bit per cell, but at that price, can't complain). http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820... Or I could go with an even bigger standard 2.5" SATA HDD. Haven't decided yet, but I'm almost certainly going with the Acer Aspire One in /some/ form. That's already decided. Duncan
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 5, 2008 7:30 UTC (Sat) by rvfh (subscriber, #31018) [Link] If you plan to recompile everything, I strongly recommend you use the Intel compiler with the right options, it might bring you up to 30% performance improvement according to Intel... The atom has got a 16-stage pipeline which is apparently unusual (I am no expert)... HTH
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 5, 2008 13:46 UTC (Sat) by jamesh (subscriber, #1159) [Link] Is that 30% compared to GCC targeting normal x86 chips or GCC targeting LPIA (Low Power Intel Architecture)? There are enough differences that it makes sense to optimise differently for Atom.
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 5, 2008 17:13 UTC (Sat) by rvfh (subscriber, #31018) [Link] It's probably with the worst possible options of GCC, as I found it in the mouth of some of my (non-free software loving) colleagues and on the Intel site ;) More seriously, I can believe that ICC will have optimizations before GCC for this processor, and would bet you can get this kind of improvement figures with some particular uses (multimedia ?). Not sure there'll be much difference on a web/file server though, as memory and disk access will make the bulk of the response time.
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 22, 2008 13:14 UTC (Tue) by Duncan (guest, #6647) [Link] The Intel compiler (ICC) is closed source. It's really quite simple. If they don't respect my rights (as expressed in the FSF's four freedoms), I don't trust them; if I don't trust them, their code doesn't go on my box. (Yes, it's their hardware, but that's different, and at least it's a relatively open spec.) So even if gcc was an order of magnitude slower, I'd still be using either it or some other open compiler. Of course, there'd be little point in my purchasing the hardware in that case, then. Even for those who will use ICC, however, at least according to a recent thread on the topic on the Gentoo-dev list, it won't compile everything, and there's additional complexity when using a mixed-compiled environment due to imperfect "impedance matching". The sig I use on the lists is relevant here: -- Duncan "Every nonfree program has a lord, a master -- and if you use the program, he is your master." Richard Stallman
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 5, 2008 18:34 UTC (Sat) by PO8 (guest, #41661) [Link] I understand that it's a popular Asian brand, and all. But seriously, "Linpus"? Is that because it's got "Open Sores"? Somebody in the marketing dept. is a mole. I can promise you that no one in Microsoft will ever, ever name a product "Micropus".
Acer's Linpus Linux Lite (Fedora) ultra portable laptop piles the pressure on Microsoft (FSM) Posted Jul 6, 2008 8:07 UTC (Sun) by Cato (subscriber, #7643) [Link] I know... Somebody needs to tell Linpus that their brand name is disastrously bad. Analysing brand names for unfortunate meanings in different languages/cultures is Marketing 101, see http://www.linguist.com/guidelines_ordering_brand_analysi... for an example of what this involves.
And yet... Posted Jul 7, 2008 15:47 UTC (Mon) by GreyWizard (subscriber, #1026) [Link] And yet Microsoft named the embedded variant of their operating system "wince" (WinCE). Marketing. Go figure.
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