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A turning point for open gadgets?A turning point for open gadgets?Posted Aug 2, 2007 8:51 UTC (Thu) by mjr (guest, #6979)In reply to: A turning point for open gadgets? by yodermk Parent article: A turning point for open gadgets?
There has actually been some trouble with US AT&T SIM cards; apparently Moko is in talks with TI, the GSM chipset provider, about it. It's doubtfully purposeful exclusion at this point, and the GSM chipset is a pretty common one, so a firmware fix from TI will probably not be out of the question. Too bad the GSM chip firmware is closed, though, so it has to be TI spesifically to take this action. In principle, also, carriers can block phones, but in the GSM world this sort of thing doesn't really commonly happen. The whole idea is that you stick your carrier's SIM in any GSM-conforming phone you want, and you're hooked up. Oh, I have one of the Neos; works with the two Finnish SIM's I've tried. When it works, that is, the software is still raw. Promising, though, all and all.
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A turning point for open gadgets? Posted Aug 4, 2007 0:29 UTC (Sat) by giraffedata (subscriber, #1954) [Link] In principle, also, carriers can block phones, but in the GSM world this sort of thing doesn't really commonly happen. The whole idea is that you stick your carrier's SIM in any GSM-conforming phone you want, and you're hooked up. A friend who has a GSM phone in the US told me a few days ago that GSM openness is only a European thing. His carrier locks his phone so that he and his wife, e.g., cannot swap SIM cards/phones. I was not aware such locking was technically possible, but since it is, it's what I would expect from US carriers, since marrying equipment and service has always been central to their business model.
A turning point for open gadgets? Posted Aug 4, 2007 1:42 UTC (Sat) by himi (guest, #340) [Link] I think it's more that carrier locking is strictly a US thing - it doesn't happen here in Australia, and as far as I know everywhere else that uses GSM outside the US.
himi
Locked phones Posted Aug 4, 2007 2:14 UTC (Sat) by corbet (editor, #1) [Link] Actually, I've seen locked phones in Italy - I think both Tim and Wind sell locked phones there. Most phones are still unlocked, though, unlike in the US, where one has to work hard to find an unlocked phone.(It's worth noting that T-Mobile will unlock phones after three months - we've taken them up on that and they followed through).
Locked phones Posted Aug 5, 2007 17:59 UTC (Sun) by Los__D (guest, #15263) [Link] SIM locked phones are pretty much standard in Denmark, in fact most people buy the locked phones to get them (a LOT) cheaper.
Luckily, the providers HAS to give the unlock code on request after half a year (I think, maybe a year), or for a fee.
A turning point for open gadgets? Posted Aug 4, 2007 10:55 UTC (Sat) by mjr (guest, #6979) [Link] Carrier-provided phones seem to often be locked where such tie-ins is allowed, yes. However, it's a completely different case from getting a carrier-independent unlocked phone yourself.
carrier-locked GSM phones Posted Aug 4, 2007 17:55 UTC (Sat) by giraffedata (subscriber, #1954) [Link] Are you saying that a US carrier will allow a customer to use a phone not provided by the carrier? And can it be any GSM phone, or just one endorsed by the carrier? One reason I have to be skeptical of that is that there is a controversy going on now with respect to some additional frequencies the US government is making available for wireless telephone (former analog TV frequencies). The question is whether owners of those frequencies should be required to offer them to users of all phones on an equal basis. The major existing carriers have opposed it -- they want to buy these frequencies and make them available for use with only certain equipment, as they can today.
carrier-locked GSM phones Posted Aug 5, 2007 18:01 UTC (Sun) by Los__D (guest, #15263) [Link] At least in Denmark, I'm pretty sure that it's illegal for providers to require that the phone is bought from them.
carrier-locked GSM phones Posted Aug 6, 2007 16:37 UTC (Mon) by sepreece (subscriber, #19270) [Link] "Are you saying that a US carrier will allow a customer to use a phone not provided by the carrier?"
Generally speaking, yes, for GSM carriers, so long as the phone is using a SIM card that either came from the carrier or has a roaming arrangement with the carrier. If they didn't, they wouldn't be able to support those roaming arrangements. I don't know whether there is a legal requirement, but I think there is a GSM requirement (I believe the carriers all have to agree to meet GSM requirements as part of licensing the technology).
I believe they also must provide emergency calling services to any GSM handset, even if it doesn't have a SIM in it at all (as CDMA carriers must for even unactivated CDMA handsets).
carrier-locked GSM phones Posted Aug 7, 2007 2:55 UTC (Tue) by omez (guest, #6904) [Link] Yes, you can purchase an unlocked GSM phone from a number of sources in the US and use it with any activated SIM card. The device's price is not subsidized by the carrier, so it will be more expensive. You won't have to extend your contract with the carrier to pay back the subsidy, though.
A GSM carrier will, after a period of time, unlock a locked phone at your request.
Not all phone features will work with all SIM cards/provider networks, and not all network features will work with all phones.
None of this applies to CDMA phones from Verizon and Sprint. I've no idea what their rules are. The Sprint EVDO is nice, though.
The current FCC controversy is not over which device works on which network. Just like you are free to use any landline telephone on the POTS network, you can use any GSM phone on any GSM network, given a good SIM card. With a landline you can also choose your provider. The POTS network owner, likely a baby bell or reincarnated ma bell, must give access to other providers at cost. The rationale is that the public helps foot the bill for the POTS network with universal and rural access fees (read: taxes). The FCC recently decided that this rationale does not apply to radio spectrum, so no such equal access requirement will apply. If you put up an antenna and get a license, it's yours alone. Another way to dodge the requirement is to build a landline network without dipping into access fees. Verizon does this with their FIOS network. There's a stink about that, too, because they rip out the copper that we subsidized when they run the fiber to your house.
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