Mark Shuttleworth interview (Linux Format) [LWN.net]

Mark Shuttleworth interview (Linux Format)

Posted Oct 3, 2006 10:49 UTC (Tue) by micampe (guest, #4384)
In reply to: Mark Shuttleworth interview (Linux Format) by Janne
Parent article: Mark Shuttleworth interview (Linux Format)

Or maybe GNOME-folks were pushing for things like that because they did not have them, whereas KDE did?

I think it was this one, and I see it as a good thing: "We need this thing, let's do it together with somebody that already knows how to do it, in a way that everybody can use the new, interoperable, version."

They are both sound-servers. And point stands: KDE had sound-server long before GNOME had one.

I never denied the point (I don't even know - nor care - if it's true or not), but surely enough Gstreamer is not a sound server at all, in the same way that Phonon isn't.

So the GNOME-way is automatically the better one, and we now have composited desktop, thanks to GNOME?

I never said nor implied anything like that. I am merely describing the differences as I perceive them (as I said before, from the GNOME side of the fence, as that's what I know).

I think we have a composited desktop thanks to the people that wrote the code.

Another thing worth noting, in my humble opinion, is that KDE supporters posting around (I know there are a lot more who just don't post at all) seem often quite defensive and inflammatory in their comments. I was amazed by how this thread was polite and insightful until a couple of the more recent entries.

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Mark Shuttleworth interview (Linux Format)

Posted Oct 3, 2006 11:31 UTC (Tue) by Janne (guest, #40891) [Link]

"think it was this one, and I see it as a good thing"

But, like I said, there were (and are) plenty of KDE-folks involved in freedesktop.org, so you can't credit GNOME alone for it.

"never denied the point (I don't even know - nor care - if it's true or not), but surely enough Gstreamer is not a sound server at all, in the same way that Phonon isn't."

Well, you claimed that Gnome was the forerunner in this area. They weren't, KDE was there first. Unless by "forerunner" you mean "first to use Gstreamer", then you would be right. But that's not what you are saying, now is it? Because if you did, then you could make just about anything in to a "forerunner".

"I never said nor implied anything like that. I am merely describing the differences as I perceive them (as I said before, from the GNOME side of the fence, as that's what I know)."

Never considered that your perception might be wrong? I have noticed that GNOME is better at PR and that they make bigger announcements about their involvement in various projects. But that does not mean that they are the only ones doing something, whereas KDE just sits there and does nothing.

"Another thing worth noting, in my humble opinion, is that KDE supporters posting around (I know there are a lot more who just don't post at all) seem often quite defensive and inflammatory in their comments."

Another thing worth noting: The GNOME-users quite often post messages like "Well, I think KDE sucks because...." and/or "I think KDE is a steaming pile of crap, but I digress". And if we then have someone defending KDE against such comments, we get comments like "Why are you so defensive and inflammatory about this?"

"I was amazed by how this thread was polite and insightful until a couple of the more recent entries."

So it's "polite" and "insightful" to say things like "GNOME pushes standards, whereas KDE does not" or "GNOME emphasises infrastructure, whereas KDE does not"? And if someone dares to defend KDE against such accusations, it's "unpolite" and "uninsightful"?

I actually went back to re-read the discussion. And there aren't any bad comments as such. True, there are comments that defend KDE (from me, for example). But they are not rude or anything like that. So am I to assume that defending KDE in itself is considered "unpolite"?

And like I already said: I actually use GNOME every day. I could use KDE if I wanted to, but I choose to use GNOME instead.

Mark Shuttleworth interview (Linux Format)

Posted Oct 3, 2006 12:51 UTC (Tue) by micampe (guest, #4384) [Link]

But, like I said, there were (and are) plenty of KDE-folks involved in freedesktop.org, so you can't credit GNOME alone for it.

I didn't credit GNOME alone, in my original comment I said precisely: "I know there are KDE developers that share these ideas"

Well, you claimed that Gnome was the forerunner in this area.

I didn't. I precisely said that I don't know - nor care - who was the forerunner. All I said was that Arts and Gstreamer aren't comparable.

Never considered that your perception might be wrong?

Sure, this is why I'm not saying anywhere that what I say is the truth, this is just what I see.

So it's "polite" and "insightful" to say things like "GNOME pushes standards, whereas KDE does not" or "GNOME emphasises infrastructure, whereas KDE does not"?

I'm pretty sure I didn't say any of this. As I know there are KDE developers working on fdo and many other transversal projects, that would be quite dumb on my part.

Well, I have my idea on the respective philosophies and approaches, it doesn't involve arguments like A is better than B or B did this before A but I obviously failed to explain it as the argument keeps drifting on useless comparisons like those.

Mark Shuttleworth interview (Linux Format)

Posted Oct 3, 2006 12:58 UTC (Tue) by Janne (guest, #40891) [Link]

My apologies, it was ajross who made those comments, and not you. I didn't notice that the person I was replying to changed midway through the discussion :)