Don't want a rootkit? Stop buying from Sony... [LWN.net]

Don't want a rootkit? Stop buying from Sony...

Posted Nov 16, 2005 13:35 UTC (Wed) by hazelsct (guest, #3659) [Link]

And how sure are we that the BIOS never phones home over the entire lifetime of the laptop? And if it doesn't for current models, what's to say it won't in the future?

I personally will never buy anything from Sony, unless and until there is a total overhaul in corporate philosophy and practice away from both rootkits and proprietary formats, devices, etc. (i.e. no more minidisks or memory sticks, and their hardware should be capable of running an open BIOS). As Londo Mollari might say, "Dishonesty and arrogance in one neat package, how efficient of you."

Minidiscs are pitiful

Posted Nov 16, 2005 13:57 UTC (Wed) by man_ls (subscriber, #15091) [Link]

Minidisc is the most stupid flop since DAT, at least in the consumer space; in the professional arena the format is alive thanks to other companies. I bought a professional model and got burned: badly thought out, poor battery life and is not so hot recording live audio. And they were supposed to replace walkmen! Meanwhile, Apple, Rio and even obscure outfits like Inovix are selling like crazy to fill the void.

Not everything from Sony is so bad: e.g. miniDV seems to be a pretty open format, and consumer video cameras are OK. But in many other areas all there is left of Sony is the high pricing.

Minidiscs are pitiful

Posted Nov 17, 2005 12:12 UTC (Thu) by khim (subscriber, #9252) [Link]

Not everything from Sony is so bad: e.g. miniDV seems to be a pretty open format, and consumer video cameras are OK.

miniDV was never SONY format. Digital8 was. And... as usual: it's gone. Now SONY is trying to show that it had miniDV in mind all along, but that's not the case.

It does prove that SONY can develop pretty open devices - when pressured enough. By default SONY will develop something proprietary and closed...

Minidiscs are pitiful

Posted Nov 18, 2005 2:09 UTC (Fri) by bk (guest, #25617) [Link]

Minidisc is still alive in the rather small niche of (often clandestine) live recording. Most tapers use MD since it is relatively cheap, available and of decent quality despite the horrid ATRAC format.

Very well-to-do tapers use DAT which has widespread use in professional recording. Unfortunately it costs an arm and a leg (although, realistically, not that much more expensive than the high end iPods...) and is somewhat obscure. People who can afford DAT often know people and can get a soundboard feed, the result is basically studio-quality live recordings.

Smart frugal tapers use DAPs that have good built-in recording features (iPods unfortunately have crippled recording with the standard firmware), like (plug!) Rockbox running on an iRiver H1xx. Lossless, high quality recording up to the limits of the built-in 20 or 40GB hard drive.

Don't want a rootkit? Stop buying from Sony...

Posted Nov 16, 2005 15:38 UTC (Wed) by gte223j (guest, #6492) [Link]

"And how sure are we that the BIOS never phones home over the entire lifetime of the laptop? And if it doesn't for current models, what's to say it won't in the future?"

A bios that can form a packet and initialize the nic and send it down the wire.........sounds rational to me........

not to mention all of the net config stuff.........gateway and route.....and ARP......

and then not only would it have to do all of this...but it would have to gather good info.......hd mbr....or files.....and know how to mount a filesystem to send the really juicy data...........

granted it is possible.....but higly improbable......

paranoia cha cha cha........

--Brian

Don't want a rootkit? Stop buying from Sony...

Posted Nov 16, 2005 20:45 UTC (Wed) by deater (subscriber, #11746) [Link]

Apparently you've never used PXE to boot Linux off a network. If you had you'd know the BIOS is perfectly capable of initializing the network card, running DHCP to get an IP address, and start making requests onto a network.

All of that before any Operating System is ever loaded.

Don't want a rootkit? Stop buying from Sony...

Posted Nov 16, 2005 21:36 UTC (Wed) by gte223j (guest, #6492) [Link]

You're right.......I haven't used PXE and it slipped my mind....my bad...........

however...... what if it is not a dhcp network??? how will it know how to get out............. and what about wireless......

the use case would be to phone home if there is a nic and there exists a dhcp server........

Again

"granted it is possible.....but highly improbable......"

I am not saying don't worry about it...but there comes a point when rationality is thrown out the window...............

--Brian

Don't want a rootkit? Stop buying from Sony...

Posted Nov 16, 2005 23:26 UTC (Wed) by clump (subscriber, #27801) [Link]

PXE is just one way x86 machines can do "networking" in the BIOS. SPARC machines have had this functionality and much more in their Openprom layer for many years. Very old SparcStations even can boot over NFS.

Why x86 vendors have never thought to offer a useful preboot layer is beyond me. Sure you can buy expensive systems and add-ons that can possibly give you SPARC-like functionality. Not to badmouth PXE, but please. That is the best standard x86 has to do network booting? x86 clearly leads in performance for the money. But for managability, even a Mac Mini can toast most Dells.

That said, my point is that just because x86 *still* isn't very mature in the BIOS does not mean a vendor couldn't phone home. Since other vendors have had smart preboots for years means the technology exists. I wouldn't put it past Sony to do such a thing.