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extortion - a rose by any other nameextortion - a rose by any other namePosted May 9, 2005 0:45 UTC (Mon) by ccyoung (guest, #16340)In reply to: with all due respect by giraffedata Parent article: Software, reverse engineering and the law
Example One:
1. using your definition that an idea that any one of 100K hackers could have "appl[ied] common sense to [his/her] profession," it's legally "obvious", assume more than 90% of all software patents are nonobvious.
2. assume that corporation A collects these patents.
3. assume that corporation A has, for all practical purposes, unlimited resources.
4. assume you are Corporation B, a software house or company that writes software in-house.
5. assume that Corporation A tells you that you are violating their patents and that it would be in your best interest to pay for usage of those patents.
what are your choices of action?
Example Two
1. assume you have a small but thriving restaurant in New York.
2. assume Mr Saprano visits you, telling you many restaurants have had many violations and, if you pay him monthly, he will arrange it so you don't have similar problems.
what are your choices of action?
Your point is that, if it's legal, it's not extortion. My point is that, if I cannot show it's illegal, it doesn't matter.
My second point is that if I see someone hurt and I need to drive on the wrong side of the road to help them then I'll drive on the wrong side of the road. What's the discussion?
It's why I mentioned prohabiton - it was a collosal failure because people simply ignored it - and ignored it with gaity. Whenever I boot up my Linux it says, "have fun!"
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extortion - a rose by any other name Posted May 9, 2005 16:03 UTC (Mon) by giraffedata (subscriber, #1954) [Link] Isn't example One the same as from your previous comment? So the analysis is the same. You hint that Corporation A's patents aren't valid -- otherwise, option (a) (taking A to court) wouldn't be an option. That being the case, there's extortion just like in the Soprano example. Corporation A is obligated to leave you alone for free, just as Mr. Soprano is obligated not to trump up charges against you, for free. Offering to perform the obligation for money is extortion. The transfer of a patent from one person to another doesn't really change the morality of the patent at all. The inventor was paid by the public with a patent for disclosing his invention. The inventor converted the payment to cash by selling the patent to Corporation A. Corporation A is converting its investment to cash by enforcing the patent. The system's doing what it's supposed to do. Your point is that, if it's legal, it's not extortion.It wasn't that simple. I talked about moral, not legal. I drew a connection between the two, saying that the fact that something is legal is a strong indication that society in general believes it is moral. Society has caused patent law to exist and grow for hundreds of years. Lots of people must believe in it -- I.e. believe it's moral to demand payment for use of an invention. My point is that, if I cannot show it's illegal, it doesn't matter. I agree. It is extortion, and wrong, and often illegal, to file or defend a lawsuit when you know you're legally wrong, in hopes that the other side will find it cheaper to pay you than pay legal fees. This is not a patent issue. But I believe this thread started out with discussion of patents that are valid under present patent law. 1. using your definition that an idea that any one of 100K hackers could have "appl[ied] common sense to [his/her] profession," it's legally "obvious", assume more than 90% of all software patents are nonobvious. I don't think it's germane to the extortion question, but: from what I've seen, about 2% of software patents are nonobvious. My second point is that if I see someone hurt and I need to drive on the wrong side of the road to help them then I'll drive on the wrong side of the road. What's the discussion? I agree. I didn't think we were discussing that.
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