Weekly Edition
Return to the Press page
| |||||||||||||
Brazil: Free software's biggest and best friend (News.com)
News.com is carrying a New York Times article on Brazil's support for free software. "By the end of April, the government plans to roll out a much-ballyhooed program called PC Conectado, or Connected PC, aimed at helping millions of low-income Brazilians buy their first computers.
And if the president's top technology adviser gets his way, the program may end up offering computers with only free software, including the operating system, handpicked by the government instead of giving consumers the option of paying more for, say, a basic edition of Microsoft Windows."
(Log in to post comments)
Funny Microsoft Quote Posted Mar 29, 2005 17:07 UTC (Tue) by clugstj (subscriber, #4020) [Link] Still, Microsoft has not given up just yet. The company, which declined to make an executive available for an interview, said in a statement that it was still "working with the PC Conectado project to see if there's a way Microsoft can help."
Help!? If Microsoft actually wanted to help, they'd donate funds to the project, not be trying to sell something. I guess they have a different definition of "help" than I do.
Funny Microsoft Quote Posted Mar 29, 2005 17:20 UTC (Tue) by euvitudo (guest, #98) [Link] The problem with receiving help from either government or corporate entities is in the fine print. The fine print would force Brazil to use the money towards Microsoft products. You still want them to "help" by contributing funds?
I certainly do not.
Vai pra frente, Brasil!
Funny Microsoft Quote Posted Mar 29, 2005 17:42 UTC (Tue) by clugstj (subscriber, #4020) [Link] Wow, now we are having problems with the definition of "donate". If I give something without strings attached, that is a donation. If I "give" something with strings attached it's a contract, not a donation.
Funny Microsoft Quote Posted Mar 29, 2005 18:23 UTC (Tue) by euvitudo (guest, #98) [Link] I seriously doubt microsoft would "donate" anything without strings attached. Sure, it may end up being a contract, but they certainly won't call it a contract... they will call it a "donation".
:)
Funny Microsoft Quote Posted Mar 29, 2005 19:54 UTC (Tue) by clugstj (subscriber, #4020) [Link] I'm not suggesting that they will donate (without strings) anything, just that they should, if indeed they want to help.
Funny Microsoft Quote Posted Mar 29, 2005 23:36 UTC (Tue) by zotz (guest, #26117) [Link] With some, I can see why you would say this. However, you can donate with strings attached without it being wonky.
Let's say a particular group you want to donate to has several ongoing projects that all need funding and they allow donors to give in general or to specify the project when giving.
To my mind, this would still be a donation situation. Yes? No?
drew
Funny Microsoft Quote Posted Mar 30, 2005 1:23 UTC (Wed) by NightMonkey (subscriber, #23051) [Link] Sounds like it'd be a donation situation. But a very different one that is being discussed here. In your scenario, it is the beneficieary of the donations that are pulling the strings, and offering to funnel moneies based on donors desires, ahead of the actual donation itself. Sort of as a nice gesture to donors who might like one micro-cause or another, rather than the whole pie (like, say, the United Way, or similar).
In this case, Microsoft would most likely dictate the terms of the donation, thereby making them the "string pullers", saying "money must be used in such and such manner, on such and such products", which the beneficiary would have ordinarily never restricted itself to doing.
Funny Microsoft Quote Posted Mar 31, 2005 17:13 UTC (Thu) by XERC (guest, #14626) [Link] Sure, it may end up being a contract, but they certainly won't call it a contract... they will call it a "donation".I've always seen the non-software-, non-IT analogue: in every nation, regardless of regime or time of observation, the military department that in the case of some nations tends to offend more than defend, is called "Department of Defence". In the U.S., former(and future) Soviet Union and most of the dictatorships it should clearly be labelled as "Department of Offence".
Funny Microsoft Quote Posted Mar 29, 2005 20:22 UTC (Tue) by ccchips (guest, #3222) [Link] If they wanted to help anyone, they wouldn't have turned the Internet into a hotbed of spam, spyware, and viruses, and then made people pay money per month to control it.
But then, corporations are notorious for downstream pollution, aren't they? It would have cost SOOOOOO much more money to write the softwre right in the first place.....
Funny Microsoft Quote Posted Mar 31, 2005 0:01 UTC (Thu) by msmelov (guest, #11243) [Link] Microsoft may not not attach any strings. Having millions of new usersusing Microsoft products instead of libre software is good enough for them. It's the same reason they donate computers to some academic institutions. Once users are comfortable with using something they will never switch...intertia is a strong force. That coupled with the possibility that they might attract new programmers. IIRC, Microsoft didn't complain immediately about software piracy in Asia for the same reason.
Brazil: Free software's biggest and best friend (News.com) Posted Mar 29, 2005 17:37 UTC (Tue) by ArsonSmith (guest, #5695) [Link] Sorry, government disallowing choice is bad wether it is for or against free software. Free software is suppose to be about choice, not limiting it.
Brazil: Free software's biggest and best friend (News.com) Posted Mar 29, 2005 18:07 UTC (Tue) by hingo (guest, #14792) [Link] Don't be silly. Brazil is not forbidding anyone to use anything. This is a special, government subsidised effort to spread a lot of low cost PC:s throughout the country. So they can very well choose whatever software they see fit. And for various reasons it is beneficial to Brazil if people started using more Free Software. But it's not like they've outlawed the use of Windows.
Brazil: Free software's biggest and best friend (News.com) Posted Mar 29, 2005 18:14 UTC (Tue) by Ed_L. (guest, #24287) [Link] Well, I wouldn't say that Brazil's govenment has exactly eliminated choice, quite yet. Keep in mind that the intended recipents of these machines are probably not, fresh out of the chute, the most technically savy of technical users. Not that many of them won't quickly become so, but there is going to be a large need for technical support and those who recieve these machines from the government will probably look for the government for help.
So how hany platforms is the government to support, and at what cost? Assuming these are generic PCs (good bet), there is nothing whatsover to stop any given user from putting whatever OS, free or foul, on his or her machine they choose -- *after* they recieve it. If they are capable of doing that, they probably don't need govenment tech support anyway. Just my 2 cents.
Brazil: Free software's biggest and best friend (News.com) Posted Mar 29, 2005 19:59 UTC (Tue) by dmarti (subscriber, #11625) [Link] Governments apply their own purchasing terms and contract requirements to ever other category of product that they acquire -- why should software vendors be the only ones allowed to dictate their own licenses to the government?
Requiring a government to accept a EULA is like requiring it to buy furniture from a high-interest "rent to own" store instead of putting its furniture requirements up for competitive bids.
Brazil: Free software's biggest and best friend (News.com) Posted Mar 31, 2005 17:37 UTC (Thu) by XERC (guest, #14626) [Link] Requiring a government to accept a EULA is like requiring it to buy furniture from a high-interest "rent to own" store instead of putting its furniture requirements up for competitive bids.I suggest that You do not underestimate the prementioned inertia. The reasons why Estonian schools have mostly only Windows in their computer classrooms, is based on a statement that a school must prepare students to be capable of achieving their tasks and as "everybody" outside the school use Windows, we have to teach Windows. It would have been a better choice to use Linux and use the saved money for some highly useful and needed videoprojectors.
Brazil: Free software's biggest and best friend (News.com) Posted Mar 29, 2005 20:21 UTC (Tue) by JoeBuck (subscriber, #2330) [Link] For some reason, no one cries that governments are disallowing choice when a government buys Microsoft software and uses it in a way that forces the public to also use Microsoft software to do business with the government (e.g. web sites that work only with IE; requirements that documents be submitted in Microsoft file formats). The complaints of government coercion only seem to arise when a government threatens to make a different choice.
Brazil: Free software's biggest and best friend (News.com) Posted Mar 29, 2005 23:51 UTC (Tue) by zotz (guest, #26117) [Link] "For some reason, no one cries that governments are disallowing choice when a government buys Microsoft software and uses it in a way that forces the public to also use Microsoft software to do business with the government (e.g. web sites that work only with IE;"
As far as I know, we have that situation here in the Bahamas now. Government site(s) that only work with IE. Somehow, I don't think MS is objecting.
all the best,
drew
Brazil: Free software's biggest and best friend (News.com) Posted Mar 29, 2005 23:39 UTC (Tue) by zotz (guest, #26117) [Link] "Sorry, government disallowing choice is bad wether it is for or against free software."
Are they acting as a government here or as a customer?
all the best,
drew
Brazil: Free software's biggest and best friend (News.com) Posted Mar 29, 2005 17:49 UTC (Tue) by ttsoares (guest, #28844) [Link] We Will... We will... Replace you !Vão catar coquinho na praia gente da Merdo$oft...
rhetorical question Posted Mar 29, 2005 21:17 UTC (Tue) by bajw (guest, #11712) [Link] > Vão catar coquinho na praia gente da Merdo$oft.
Not knowing Portuguese, I turned to babelfish. No help...
"They go to catar coquinho in the beach people of merdo$oft."
Huh?
It is not anything worth reading Posted Mar 29, 2005 21:49 UTC (Tue) by hmh (subscriber, #3838) [Link] It boils down to "Go screw yourselves with a coconut, Microsoft shitheads".
"Great" piece of wisdom and "intelligent" commentary, that one. Just the kind of thing that will further the adoption of Libre software in Brazil. NOT!
This is the kind of crap that really should not be posted, ever.
rhetorical question Posted Mar 30, 2005 2:20 UTC (Wed) by flewellyn (subscriber, #5047) [Link] I know it's not accurate, but your translation is hilarious.
Return on Developer Time Investment Posted Mar 29, 2005 18:03 UTC (Tue) by chant (subscriber, #20286) [Link] Regardless of the politics, I think this presents an excellent opportunity for the free software community to grow.
A relatively small investment of time by developers to ensure a smooth experience for early and novice users of these systems has the potential to provide an exponential return of free software developers in the future.
Has there been any response to these considerations by the larger free software groups, such as distribution vendors or Debian, for example?
If only... Posted Mar 29, 2005 21:54 UTC (Tue) by hmh (subscriber, #3838) [Link] No. Currently, stuff such as "Freedows" is the most likely candidate.
It is not exactly the most conforting of thoughts.
Return on Developer Time Investment Posted Mar 30, 2005 9:09 UTC (Wed) by paulnicklin (guest, #28110) [Link] Absolutely...The UK National Health Service just committed half a billion pounds to MS over 10 years - that would have built a PILE of FOSS - even if you take out the support costs. And they wouldn't have to spend ANOTHER 1/2 billion in 2015 - just when I'll be needing new hips... They think they're getting a bargain because MS will spend 40m developing a "Clinician Desktop" that they'll get a kickback from. (it's a special desktop that will lock out ISVs so that MS get monopoly on the healthcare apps too, or at least they'll all require Office)
Return on Developer Time Investment Posted Mar 30, 2005 17:47 UTC (Wed) by andrel (subscriber, #5166) [Link] Debian developers always do their own thing; trying to get the whole group to do anything in sync is like herding cats. (That's why the release process takes so bloody long.)That said, there are large coalitions within the project actively working on these issues. See for example the Custom Debian Distros. The South African Unbuntu offshoot of Debian also seems to be working hard on making free software useful for non-techies.
Brazil: Free software's biggest and best friend (News.com) Posted Mar 29, 2005 21:59 UTC (Tue) by huffd (guest, #10382) [Link] I saw an article about this more than a week ago and from the verbiage doubted that they had the "staying power" to turn down Microsoft. Feeling instead like so much of the third world has done they were just trying to get Microsoft to better their offer, that much apparently worked.
The article left me with the inclination that they were just saying "we tried" then would sell themselves, "the poor country that they are" into bondage.
If they go with FOSS, God Bless them. If not there are two other countries that will profit from increased interest debt to buy software from Microsoft.
If this were Mexico, I'd say definitely yes... Posted Mar 30, 2005 3:11 UTC (Wed) by leonbrooks (guest, #1494) [Link] Brasil, however, has a bit more pride and principle, and the two pollies shoving the stick into Microsoft's spokes here have done serious damage to Microsoft's pretended innocence before. That bodes well for the outcome.I think you'd have to visit Brasil to understand just how much of an impact FOSS is already having there. Do any Australian, American or European ATMs sport Tux wallpaper? The ATMs of the State bank in Rio Grande do Sul (BanRiSul) do. Other factors which are invisible to most USians include:
Either way, and despite any important details that I may have missed ("faux that I may have passed", as a friend of mine says), it looks like they're fully committed to digital independence.
If this were Mexico, I'd say definitely yes... Posted Apr 5, 2005 16:44 UTC (Tue) by hazelsct (guest, #3659) [Link] Indeed, Brazil has the 15th-highest GDP (as of 2003), ahead of other giants such as Russia, Indonesia, and all but six European countries. (Source: http://www.worldbank.org/data/databytopic/GDP.pdf)
When/if it happens, this distribution of machines running Linux will make a huge impact.
|
|||||||||||||