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Russ Nelson proposes new license requirementsRuss Nelson proposes new license requirementsPosted Mar 3, 2005 1:49 UTC (Thu) by jwb (guest, #15467)In reply to: Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements by rickmoen Parent article: Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements
Listen Rick, if you write an essay that says "Blacks Are Lazy" (as does Russ, and the "blacks are lazy" phrase remains even after his 10th edition) you are a racist. There is quite a difference between saying someone is lazy, which is a criticism of that person's character, and saying that someone is underincentivized, which is a criticism of the market. The market criticism is barely perceptible through the racist crap. The only explanations are 1) he really is a racist, or 2) he cannot appreciate the nuance between lazy and underincentivized. In either case, I'd rather not have him in a political position leading a group which purports to stand for open source software.
If people don't want their words to have consequences, they ought to not publish them. There's a lot of crap in usenet archives that I'd rather forget, but it's my own fault and I don't expect other people to self-censor just to protect my delicate ego.
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Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements Posted Mar 3, 2005 2:09 UTC (Thu) by LinuxLobbyist (guest, #6541) [Link] So do you think Mason Weaver's book titled "It's Okay To Leave the Plantation" is racist, too? Seriously, now, judging things by the title? Whatever happened to the slashdot admonishment, "RTFA"? Note that I'm not implying you haven't read the essay in question, or even that the essay is good, but calling someone racist for a poor choice of words isn't any better than the essay itself. And you've pretty much admitted that you would judge an article written by Rick Moen titled "Blacks are Lazy" by it's poorly chosen title. Signed, an angry white male (like that should make any difference, unless you are a racist, of course). -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets
Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements Posted Mar 3, 2005 3:25 UTC (Thu) by rickmoen (subscriber, #6943) [Link] "jwb" wrote:Listen Rick, if you write an essay that says "Blacks Are Lazy"... ...then, you are significant risk of spurious personal attack from anonymous trolls who either can't be bothered to read it, or do and are prepared to throw common sense, not to mention any residual personal ethics, to the wind. Right, got that. If people don't want their words to have consequences, they ought to not publish them. Speaking of consequences, who were you, again? Oh, right, a particularly disgusting anonymous critic of people who actually do perform useful work for our community. Well, my community, anyway. Rick Moen
Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements Posted Mar 3, 2005 3:41 UTC (Thu) by jwb (guest, #15467) [Link] You seem hell-bent on casting a happy light on the essay, so I'll be the first in this flamefest to actually introduce the primary material.Black people are lazy in that they work less hard than whites. Not only that, but they are rational to be lazy! After black slaves were freed, they worked less. The value of their leisure time (highly valued after a lifetime of slavery) exceeded the pay from their work. Also, ongoing American racism has caused blacks to be paid less than whites. He goes on in the next few sentences to dig himself further into his hole in the course of making a bizarre and completely unfounded argument about races and economics. But the point still stands that he's using "lazy" - a character insult - to substitute for his real point about economics. As I said above, he's either a racist or the worst writer in the English language today. Michael Tiemann is going to be a *far* better choice. Besides his numerous contributions to the code base he also has a proven ability to interact with individuals, organizations, and corporations without wedging his boot in his mouth.
Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements Posted Mar 3, 2005 3:49 UTC (Thu) by LinuxLobbyist (guest, #6541) [Link] I'm sorry, jwb, what did you say your real name was? /me slaps foreheadDoh! Silly me. -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets
Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements Posted Mar 3, 2005 3:50 UTC (Thu) by rickmoen (subscriber, #6943) [Link] "jwb" wrote:You seem hell-bent on casting a happy light on the essay... This statement is, of course, in glorious defiance of the plain facts of my post. Either that, or you have a selective inability to comprehend the words "rather poorly written and silly personal essay". Pick one, please: incompetence or malice. But, of course, you don't have to worry about issues of personal responsibility: You're yet another anonymous flamer. Or would you rather sign your name to these name- calling exercises and personal-attack drivel you've been gracing us with, which misdeed you're now compounding with flagrantly selective quotation? Want to dig yourself in deeper, "jwb"? Rick Moen
Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements Posted Mar 3, 2005 4:04 UTC (Thu) by bk (guest, #25617) [Link] Since when is "racist" equivalent to "silly"? Either you are trivializing racism or you are defending the essay as not being racist, perhaps because you share those views.
"Black people are lazy in that they work less hard than whites."
Defend the non-racist nature of that statement, please.
Thanks,
Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements Posted Mar 3, 2005 4:17 UTC (Thu) by LinuxLobbyist (guest, #6541) [Link] "Black people are lazy in that they work less hard than whites." Defend the non-racist nature of that statement, please. If he did that, he would be playing into your own game of flagrant selective quoting. Funny, I think I heard your demand before. Oh, yes! It went like this: "do you still be your wife", or something like that. Click on the link I gave earlier to take you to Dave Horowitz' response to Al Franken's accusation of racism and read at least the first paragraph or two for a little education. Pay attention to words like "toxic" and "witch-hunt". Unless, of course, you don't wish to be exposed. But of course, you don't have to worry about that publically, now, do you mister "bk" aka Anonymous Coward #2? -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets
Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements Posted Mar 3, 2005 4:21 UTC (Thu) by rickmoen (subscriber, #6943) [Link] "bk" wrote:Oh, look. It's another anonymous flamer! (Of course, it might actually be the same one. Once cannot tell.) Since when is "racist" equivalent to "silly"? The answer to your impertinent question is, of course, "Mu": The question cannot be answered as posed on account of the whack-assed assumption on which it rests. The rest of us, who are possessed of both a capacity for common sense and the inclination to stick to fair commentary that we're willing to actually stand behind, read the personal-blog essay (if we gave a damn) and thought "Well, I think I see what he's trying to say, but it's badly expressed and not worth spilling virtual ink over anyway." But you're of course burdened with neither quality, and so can stop with blatant name- calling slurs and question-begging questions that insult our intelligence. And who were you again, by the way? If you think I'm going to "defend" anything at all, ever, to the likes of you, you're severely deluded, sir/ madam/critter. Whether you're one anonymous flamer or several, I'd rather just drop the lot of you into the same oubliette. And good riddance. Rick Moen
Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements Posted Mar 3, 2005 5:46 UTC (Thu) by RussNelson (guest, #27730) [Link] "Black people are lazy in that they work less hard than whites." Defend the non-racist nature of that statement, please.Out of context, it is indefensible. In context, I have abandoned it. What is your point? That you can quote people out of context? Congratulations, you know how to use a text editor! It's obvious that you, yourself, are a racist. Why else you would be attacking me so strongly?
Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements Posted Mar 3, 2005 5:48 UTC (Thu) by RussNelson (guest, #27730) [Link] he's either a racist or the worst writer in the English language today.Okay, we've now established that I'm not a racist. Do you care to stop calling me one?
Russ Nelson proposes new license requirements Posted Mar 3, 2005 6:20 UTC (Thu) by RussNelson (guest, #27730) [Link] the "blacks are lazy" phrase remains even after his 10th edition) you are a racist."Now playing #1 on the Ignoramus chart is jwb!" Dude, it's simply not possible to remove the "blacks are lazy" (oh no, I said it again) phrase without deleting the post entirely. My preference is to retract it completely in every way, shape, or form. I simply didn't anticipate that ANYBODY could be SO STUPID as to think that I ACTUALLY believe that BLACKS ARE LAZY (there, I said it again). Anybody with two brain cells to scrape together who reads the original posting can see that my point was that any perception that BLACKS ARE LAZY (oh, no, I said it again!) is caused exactly and precisely by racism, and that the original genesis of the idea was very likely the fact that freed slaves chose to work less hard than when THEY WERE BEATEN INTO WORKING HARD. There, have I given you enough material to quote me out of context? I may as well, since you and others have already done it.
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